Article 50

Discussion in 'Just Talk' started by parahandy, Aug 18, 2016.

  1. How easily you can mock this issue.

    As in many other European countries we are seeing a beginning of extreme right-wing influence which has been given a major boost by the Brexit campaign in the UK. It is demonstrated by the 'blame' landed at the feet of 'immigrants' and the rise in casual racism from before and since that vote.

    A large tract of the UK's population (including many on here) now firmly believe that immigrants are the cause of this country's ills.

    It ain't.

    But that's one little group taken care off.

    What'll come next from a right-wing party? Who shall we persecute next? Well, it'll be the low paid and unemployed for a start. What shall we do about this scum? Well, let's look at repealing the Human Rights Act for a start - which even T May herself was seemingly exploring before - and worker's rights. They'll bludy take whatever job they're offered or they're out on their ear, I tell ya.

    That's looking goooood - stops them pesky proles from claiming stuff that's a tad costly to us tax payers.

    Whilst us wealth generators deserve another neat tax break.

    What next? I know - let's privatise the NHS! I mean, I don't use it - I wouldn't dream of mixing with the proles - so why should I contribute towards it? You think that's going too far? Well, why not ask Farage and Arron Banks ('Leave' founder) and even Johnson himself.

    Go on - find out what they want. 'Cos these are your leaders. These are the guys who spouted the lies that you fell for. And they want partial or full privatisation of the NHS.

    They are your heroes. The ones you followed during this campaign. And presumably still do. These are the guys you are shouting for! LOUDLY and PROUDLY on here.

    When oh when are you going to get the 'picture'?

    When is something going to go 'click' in your head?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 27, 2016
    PaulBlackpool likes this.
  2. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    I can't count Russia as being a European country.
     
  3. Lol - he got you there, Chips...:rolleyes:
     
  4. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    Goodness sake, man. Quit it with the attempts at belittling people, second thought's, continue, what fun.

    What do you think will happen, when, as you say all of these draconian measures are doled out on the working classes?
    A: We're that thick we will thank em for it?

    B: We won't even realise, because were, thick?

    C: We won't vote for them again! At the next election, because we're thick?

    Just one thing, DA.
    Ya do realise that a good sized portion of us leave voters, also made it possible for your beloved, Blair, to stay in power for as long as he did.
    We're we all thick back then, too?
     
  5. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    Oh, a good boy treat, thrown from your idol there, chips, good boy.
     
  6. Sorry, Longs - a large proportion of those who voted for Leave didn't actually understand what they were doing.

    They thought they were 'Taking back control' when Britain actually has all the control it needs. This is true - everything it's handed to the EU to decide on was handed - very intentionally - to the EU to decide on. 'Cos it was sensible to do so. It's how we relate so smoothly to our EU partners - we need to have these same worker's laws, human rights, etc.

    They thought they were 'saving Britain's Sovereignty'. When Britain's sovereignty was never - is never - in doubt. We are, and always will be, our own sovereign nation.

    They thought they were stopping immigration, because they were led to believe it was the cause of the UK's ills. It isn't. Our ills are mainly as a result of the financial crash followed by a Tory government.

    Mr Ha thought it was about peanuts. I think he was wrong.

    And this is the biggie - because these people were hurting more than most of us due to the Tory policies after the financial crash, they thought they were 'getting their own back at the ''establishment"'. When, in fact, as we all know, including you, that it was the worst of the establishment (banking & business multi-millionaires) who were misleading them and pushing for Brexit.

    Oh yes it was. You know this. (I ain't going to apologise... :p)


    I don't blame the misguided Leave voters. They simply do not have the tools to make such a decision. The complexity of the EU is simply too big for them to get a handle on. As much of it is for me.

    These are ordinary folk. I don't mean that as an insult, just a simple statement of fact. 'Hard-working Sun readers'. Unsophisticated. But that's fine - they simply shouldn't have been given this decision to make. It was carzy.

    And they've been 'had'. Kippered. Good and proper.

    And the honest tragedy is, they will be the ones to suffer most.


    Go on, Longs - tell me it wasn't like that. Tell me that Farage is an honest blokie bloke who's out for the common man. Go on - tell me that.

    Tell me that Trump isn't playing the same dishonest game with his own blue-collar population.

    Go on - just say it ain't so.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 27, 2016
  7. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Hmmmmmm A united Europe can prevent this?? I think a lot of French and German citizens wouldn't believe you DA (neither do they believe the politicians preaching mass immigration and peace in the same sentence) Do you read the papers? Watch the news? Perhaps you should take off those spectacles, you know,,, the one's with the rose tinted lenses. Merkel's still advocating letting hundreds of thousands of so called asylum seekers. Young men in the main who should be fighting for these same freedoms in their own countries instead of hot footing it for Europe at the slightest mention of trouble. What about the ideologist lot also tagging along with them? The one's the security forces have no record of? How exactly do you stop them (if you don't know who they are?? )
     
  8. Sigh...

    A lot of German and French citizens would disagree, indeed, JJ. As do many Brits. They're called 'Leavers' here, and the far-right elsewhere. And they hate anyone different to themselves.

    They want disunity not unity. They think that's the way to 'go'. They want to build walls. They want to persecute others. They somehow think there's something special about them - they somehow deserve the freedom and security and human rights that are handed to them simply because they were lucky enough to be born here. How dare the rest of humanity encroach on this!

    You simply don't 'get' humanity, do you JJ?

    And you've been led here by Farage and Gove and IDS and Johnson. I bet you get a warm fuzzy feeling when you watch Trump too.

    You're welcome.
     
  9. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    I've gotta say i agree with your broad generalised, one sided conclusion of a typical leave, voter.
    I'm sure thousands, strutted into polling stations up and down the country, proudly displaying a copy of the, Sun, Star or daily mail, and it goes without saying that a good number would hold on to every word that exited, Farage's gob.
    But, to stereotype ever leave supporter to the same ilk is nothing but dishonesty on your part.
    The same as announcing that every remained is well educated, and knows for certain what those in charge of the, EU, are planning for the future.

    Take, for example, Frank Field, who you held in in high esteem, you obviously respected the man, and he voted leave.
    In your opinion does he now belong in the same category as all the rest, an idiot, don't know nowt. Or could it be, that he sees things from a different perspective, just as many others do?
     
    Deleted member 33931 likes this.
  10. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    The time you spend on this forum alone, could be better spent practicing what you preach, if you're genuinely interested in humanitarian issues? Go walk the walk.
     
    Deleted member 33931 likes this.
  11. Damn, touché... :oops:

    Of course what I say doesn't apply to every leave voter, but I have good reason to suspect it's a pretty accurate generalisation. Ie - it applies to a greater or lesser extent to the vast majority. It applies (sorry) to those on here, to thoise I've spoken to in 'real life', and those I've seen interviewed on TV and in the papers.

    The same generalisation also applies to Remainers. Citing Frank Field (or David Owen) does not a summer make. They are very much the exceptions.

    I would happily bet on which way a person voted within a few minutes of meeting them. (I don't mean by asking...)

    And the bulk of Leavers used Farage, Gove et al to give 'legitimacy' to their deeper and natural feelings of 'others'.
     
  12. Well, I do attend and support two local charities, both dealing with children. That's quite human.

    Anyhoo, I do love a bludy good argument. That's quite human too... :rolleyes:
     
    longboat likes this.
  13. PaulBlackpool

    PaulBlackpool Screwfix Select

    I was on holiday in mid Sussex a week or two before the referendum. It was in the middle of nowhere. We rented a cottage where the owner had a nice old house with stables. We never discussed the referendum with her but she said most of the farms down there had been sold off to rich people from London some of who had horses. The guy next door was a computer executive. There were "leave " signs everywhere and I doubt that any of them read the "Sun". More like the Daily Mail or the Times. The only reason I could see for the forest of "leave " signs was that they were not far from the South Coast where immigrants landed from France. As you know I voted to remain. I am not worried about 300,000 net immigration in a population of 60,000,000. All these signs made me feel uncomfortable.
    This generalisation that the older generation voted to leave also upsets me as I am (or hope to be) 70 in October. One of the reasons I voted to remain was that my son works in the aircraft industry, specifically Health & Safety.
     
  14. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    The trouble is its net 300 thou this year, hence why our population has risen 10 mill in as many years.
     
  15. These rich people will be happy either way - they'll be ok. They probably even like the whole right-wing agenda - tax cuts, privatisation of the NHS etc.

    And, to put it bluntly, they don't give much of a toss about anyone else. They have their second homes, and still want a moan about 'immigrants coming in here and taking everything...' What do they want - a third home?

    This is the whole point about the EU vote. I can accept the 'reasoning' (tho' I despise it) of the well-off businesspeeps, bankers, politicians whatevs who genuinely voted for the Leave's right-wing agenda. This will undoubtedly suit them chust fine. I'm sure Gove, IDS, Lawson et al are their heroes.

    That's not the issue here. The issue is that they wouldn't have gotten anywhere with their vote had they not lied and tricked the poorest and most needy in our society to vote alongside them, on the pretext it was a 'vote against the establishment'.

    That was truly dishonourable.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 27, 2016
    PaulBlackpool likes this.
  16. PaulBlackpool

    PaulBlackpool Screwfix Select

    You are 100% out, 2006 60M 2016 65M

    And not all the 5m would be due to immigration.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2016
  17. The trouble is that people like you cite numbers and don't give these people a chance.

    Immigrants have had an effect on wages, yes - of a fraction of 1%. They are generally better educated, and harder working than the indigenous Brits. Overall they have been of huge benefit. And freedom of movement within the EU should be a basic human right - let's face it, there's quite a few of us Brits living and working abroad.

    Surprised you don't mention how Brits aversely affect the house prices in places like Portugal and Spain. And they hardly integrate, do they?

    Yes, we do need to ensure that proper resources are made available so that people - Brits and incomers - don't suffer. Ultimately, tho', we will be the beneficiaries.
     
  18. PaulBlackpool

    PaulBlackpool Screwfix Select

    Agreed . I know someone who is very close to me who voted by post ie. in advance ) to come out and realised before voting day that he had made a mistake.
     
  19. PaulBlackpool

    PaulBlackpool Screwfix Select

    Are looking at the next thread up Phil?
     
  20. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    And the people responsible for many deaths in Europe in recent months do get humanity do they? Go on DA indulge me,,,, Just how many of these refugees entering Europe are bonafide refugees and how many are entering to carry on the cause of ISIS ? How do we tell the real ones from the bombers, killers etc?
     

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