Don't panic it's not as bad as it seems. Now that i've got your attention, I have taken a supply of the lighting circuit in the loft to feed a tv distribution amplifier, the feed goes through a fused DP switch with neon indicator fused at 2a and located on a wall on the landing. Expect it to draw no more than 100mA. At the time I put a flex outlet plate on the wall in the loft near to where the aerial cable comes in and connected a lamp/flex to it while doing other work in the loft. After looking around for a few amplifiers all that I can find have a moulded 13A plug and I'm reluctant to lop off the plug in case the unit has to be sent back if faulty and this caused problems with warranty. Also correct me if I'm wrong but if it is hard wired it becomes a fixed appliance. I'm sure it will be safe as its fused at 2a. If someone else comes along and fits a 13a fuse for some other use the worst that could happen is the 6a mcb in the CU will trip. What is the professional view on puting in a 13a socket under this situation. DJW
Not strictly cricket old boy, Regs would frown upon such a crude practice! But, if YOU KNOW its there, and you know what you've done and how you've done it, and you are not selling up to move house next week, then I can't see a problem. Best thing is to lop off the 13A plug as soon as the warranty's up and rewire as you've suggested via an FCU. If you do decide to move house BEFORE the warranty expires, then swap the 13A skt for the FCU before you leave!!
You can't put a 13amp socket on a 6amp lighting circuit full stop, even if you know what its for. You have to look at what would happen at worst, you forget the socket in the loft and move, the new owner see's a nice socket outlet in the loft which will do the immersion heater nicely. It keeps blowing the fuse so he puts in a bigger one, this causes the 1.5mm to overheat, thus........ Either cut the plug top off or wire in a 13amp supply.
Cutting the plug off of electrical equipment will not void the warrenty. You are allowed (as far as i know) to remove the plug and re-fit another if required - this is common practice with hifi and computer equipment. Joe
The correct way, is to run a Fused Spur from a bedroom ring main, via a 13a Fused Connection Unit, to supply the aerial amplifier splitter box etc. Wire in 1.5mm cable, which is safe, as long as its fed from the OUTPUT terminals of the 13amp FCU.
How about fitting a round pin 2 amp socket in the roofspace ? If you're going to lop the plug off, you can get 2 amp small round pin plugs and sockets for them (fits standard pattress). This way it at least stops Mr Muppet (or whoever) trying to draw a big current off the socket with a standard 13 amp plug. These 2A sockets are in fairly common use aren't they ? - for switched lighting circuit outlets. Why don't Screwfix sell them ? (they only sell the 5amp ones last time I looked.
There are several lateral thinking solutions to this - although the sparkies out there may dislike some of them. You could fit a shaving socket in there. Fit a shaving plug on the end of a single Standard socket extension cable and plug your device into that. That way you don't have to remove the plug and any other low current devices you have could be used in there. You could wire the amp up to a light bayonet fitting - i.e. the male part. Fit a light socket and plug into that. Personally I would run a new cable up to the loft from a separate MCB as a completely separate spur (using 2.5mm cable)
"You could wire the amp up to a light bayonet fitting - i.e. the male part. Fit a light socket and plug into that. " Interesting idea.... Surely this aerial amp is only like a 25watt bulb - its not drawing much current (100mA). If it's a permanent installation could it not be wired straight into a handy junction box ? (Can literally see the other sparkies cringing at this one !) - okay, fit a switch inline as an isolator then ! I can't really see that a complete new circuit is required, although a 13 amp socket in the roof may come in handy in the future avoiding extension leads through the loft hatch. Amongst all the laughter about these 2amp plugs - MK still make 'em - www.qvsdirect.co.uk sell 'em and I've fitted quite a few of 'em ! And interior designer bods just love 'em ! (table lights, uplighter stands, other funny lights all switched/timed at the wall).
Hi ditch the 13a socket and fit a click connector just in case your not familiar with these they are a typ of ceiling rose that incorporates its own detachable plug that way no one is going to plug in anything else
WHAT? A Round Pin 2amp BS 646 plug - you must be joking! I thought they became extinct years ago... What are you talking about mb, of course there not extinct. MK still make them for lighting points, in fact there is 2, 3 and 5 amp plugs and sockets. I think fitting a 2amp socket is a good idea and would stop future new owners plugging in 13amp supply.
MICC: (or anyone) No, still don't understand why you cant fit a standard 13A socket on a 6A circuit. Why are you assuming its necessary to allow for the risk of someone changing the fuse (mcb?) because it keeps tripping/blowing? dont you think he would notice the lights going out at the same time? Might guess it was a socket added to a 6A lighting circuit? Or must all installations take into account that someone might do something stupid in the future? In that case, surely it is not possible to fit anything! Riddle me this, which is worse? A 13A socket connected as a spur by one 2.5mm cable to a 32A ring, or 13A socket connected by 1.0mm cable to a 6A lighting circuit?
WHAT? A Round Pin 2amp BS 646 plug - you must be joking! I thought they became extinct years ago... Erm just to let you know MB they are still currently available,check out MK's new cat. sf
I found a fan hetaer wired straight off the lighting circuit today (via FCU with 13A BS 1363 fuse mind!) due to the fact the ring for u/stairs was not run in the loft space (about the only thing that WAS right)so suppose he thought,this will do nicely.
Dam, the regulations state you must fit an appropriate sized fuse/mcb to protect the cable. The regs try to foresee any errors that could be made, they can not cover everything, but if you follow their rules you should be safe. You can not put a 13amp outlet on a 6amp circuit, if it kept tripping they would buy a higher rating breaker from b&q etc. and fit that, I have seen welding rods in place of fuse wire. And as for your riddle, give me a break!
was it a very low powered fan heater?... at a pinch youmight call an extractor a fan heater..it blows and must heat the air, just not much. I assume you are shocked because it was something like a 13A fan heater on a 6A breaker, not a 5A heater on a 10A breaker? micc: yep, point of the riddle is that it is considered ok to connect a 13A socket to a 32A ring using one 2.5 cable. this may be considered appropriate but the cable is not well protected. dont see how there is any problem connecting a 1.0 cable with a 13A socket to a 6A fuse/breaker. Problem only comes if people start doing stupid things with the installation. that is always a risk anyhow. point was, which reg bans connecting standard sockets to 6A circuits?
Surely the question Seavigil is asking is "what's the best/safest way of providing supply to an appliance, in the roofspace, that only seems to draw 100mA" Since a typical 100watt lightbulb is drawing 400-odd mA, the need for a seperate supply capable of carrying 13 amps is being demanded not by the use or appliance, but by the plug it happens to be fitted with ! What the regs say would be interesting, yes, and no doubt, fan heaters, kettles, etc. aside, the exisiting wiring may or may not be able to cope with a theoretical 'other' appliance connected up via a standard socket if it were fitted. The mcb might, or might not, depending upon breaking time and overload current protect the circuit. I'd love to hear from Seavigil to find out what he/she has now decided to do.
The mcb damn sure should be able to protect the cabling. 6A circuits have a pretty good overload margin on 1.0 cable,better yet on 1.5. All circuits should be designed to withstand overloads and disconnect safely. Heres another (real) case. 6A mcb running one socket via 1.0mm cable. Socket is fixed to ceiling and powers an automatic garage door opener, also fixed to ceiling. Dedicated circuit, as it were mission critical since you dont want to be locked out. Possible to plug something else into the socket, but difficult. What do regs say about this one?
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