2 electricians 2 different answers

Discussion in 'Electricians' Talk' started by notajarofglue, Nov 15, 2015.

  1. notajarofglue

    notajarofglue New Member

    HELLO SCREWFIX! i need a cracked socket in my bedrooom replaced and a new bathroom cabinet.

    electriciaan 1 says socket will have to be built in rcd type as fuse board does not have rcd built in and he wouldnt fit the cabinet i have brought as it has a light on it and anything in the bathroom also needs rcd protection so might be better off having new fuse board first. the one there at the moment has a light on it and it works but the glass has cracked and is looking worn out now anyway

    electrican 2 says he can replace socket with normal one and cabinet i bought in a morning and the rcd thing is a load of rubbish as there is no new wiring going in

    who is right as i want to make sure it is done properly and not cut corners
     
  2. Lectrician

    Lectrician Screwfix Select

    Replacing damaged kit like for like is maintenance. The socket can be swapped no problem. Adding one would be a different matter.

    The bathroom cabinet is a little bit of a grey area. I doubt the cabinet is the same, so it's not like for like. Tricky one to call. I would feel more comfortable with RCD protection being present for the cabinet.
     
  3. DNR Plumbing

    DNR Plumbing Active Member

    Is your wiring upto date?? A CU swap to an RCD protected CU isn't a massive job of you don't need a rewire and would be safer but obviously if you need a rewire its £££.
    Replacing the socket no problem as for the bathroom gray area but still can be done as The BS for domestic wiring isn't actually law but is best practice.
     
  4. stu1312

    stu1312 Member

    I agree that I'd prefer rcd protection in the bathroom but I didn't think like for like was that exact, otherwise you could say a socket replacement would have to be the same brand.

    Could always put an RCD fuse spur inline to the cabinet if you really wanted to.
     
  5. Rulland

    Rulland Screwfix Select

    As Lec for socket. But imho cabinet also ok, at the end of the day it's just like changing a wall light, like for like, except that this light has a cabinet around it!, just my take anyway.
     
    DNR Plumbing likes this.
  6. notajarofglue

    notajarofglue New Member

    thanks so does it depend on what the electrician is prepared to do? Is it the same for an outside light swap out?? just remembered the first electriciaan said all sockets have to have this rcd protection now so if any more sockets break will need these build in ones or rcd at the fuse board
     
  7. DNR Plumbing

    DNR Plumbing Active Member

    It all depends on how the regulations are interpreted but replacement of a fitting or socket front etc I would say is maintenance but adding to a circuit or adding to a circuit wouldn't be allowed
     
  8. Lectrician

    Lectrician Screwfix Select

    The NIC do not think it correct to be swapping light fittings from a pendent to a new fancy one (unless pendent to pendent due to damage) without checking bonding etc, and if swapping sockets from white to chrome, similarly.

    Swapping a white damaged socket with another white one of any make is clearly maintenance IMO. Swapping a cabinet is in my eyes quite a grey area. Most would probably just do it, assuming the installation is in good shape.
     
    notajarofglue and DNR Plumbing like this.
  9. notajarofglue

    notajarofglue New Member

    thanks lectrician. so the first one was right he certainly seemed confident and just said thats how the new electricians rules are. so the replacement socket doesnt have to be rcd inside it as its not a new socket but replacing the faulty one yeah? maybe i misunderstood him but i thought he said all sockets fitted from now on have to have this
     
  10. DNR Plumbing

    DNR Plumbing Active Member

    No need for RCD sockets if you have a RCD protected feed but have seen industrial installs with both but never seen RCD sockets in a house (have seen inside a garage for use outside)
     
    Phil Hyde likes this.
  11. Rulland

    Rulland Screwfix Select

    I don't think the first one was/is right tbh, and surely swapping any make of socket to another make is just 'maintenence ', socket to socket, at the end of the day they all have just 3 connections, as I said previously, cabinet, hmm, but let's be realistic in our interpretation of 7671.
     
  12. stateit

    stateit Screwfix Select

    It's up to the electrician to accept the work or not.

    Socket - no problem.

    Cabinet: If the customer was totally averse to the extra work being carried out I'd note on the invoice the customer was made aware of the benefits of RCD protection but declined.
     
  13. notajarofglue

    notajarofglue New Member

    THANKS ALL stateit that seems a fair way of this very murky way of working! i just googled bonding after reading above. does that mean he is unlikely to do any work if the water pipe is not wired in to the fuse board then? this is getting worse by the minute lol
     
  14. DNR Plumbing

    DNR Plumbing Active Member

    Ask a third sparky to come take a look
     
  15. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    I have an rcd socket in my living room as I have french windows into the garden. I didn't install it, it was there when I bought the house.
     
    DNR Plumbing likes this.
  16. DNR Plumbing

    DNR Plumbing Active Member

    Good idea if the power is to be used outside I guess
     
  17. Rulland

    Rulland Screwfix Select

    There are many ways to skin a cat, unfortunately, one will be very lucky if all agree on a certain way, especially sparks and BS 7671, it doesn't necessarily mean that the way one sparks interprets it is wrong imo.

    I myself would do both tasks and sleep easy, the fixed wiring etc is in no worse a state than it was before the work was undertaken, the regs aren't retrospective, basic tests should be carried out, as per BS 7671.
     
  18. Mr. Handyandy

    Mr. Handyandy Screwfix Select

    I think you have to take the regs and interpret 'like for like' as 'similar for similar'.

    Not sure if certificated work allows for touching things in bathrooms unless upgraded to RCD protection, though.

    Mr. HandyAndy - Really
     
  19. DNR Plumbing

    DNR Plumbing Active Member

    BS standing for Bull S#*t ??
     
  20. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    Only diy here but wondering apart from regs and interpretation is it actually safer to have rcd protection on bathroom electrics

    If CU is mcb type could you not just replace bathroom (upstairs lighting I guess) module with rcd type, not a great deal of expense then but improved safety ?
     

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