Blocked drain, struggling, any suggestions

Discussion in 'Plumbers' Talk' started by zak99, Apr 21, 2016.

  1. zak99

    zak99 Member

    Have a flat in a Victorian house in east London. Two flats.
    Downstairs all OK their drain is on one side of building. Downstairs is mine and rented out.
    Upstairs soil pipe and and grey water on other side of building. Its blocked and soiled water is coming back up open drain so they must join.

    Drain clearance company was out and tried hard, they cut access hole in soil stack and physical rodded, also jetted including gulley jet whatever that is. No go.

    Cant find any manholes or rodding eyes.. Our House is number 1 and neighbour number 3 apparently had a manhole but built over !! Their loo and all is running free.

    Drain co left and said call Thames Water who came and said its not theirs because blockage is not after shared join.

    Not 100 percent which way drain run underground. Could be toward neighbour or maybe back under house to other side.

    Drain guy said he was rodding OK up to 4meters.

    In this age of techno Is there a device to put down pipe on rod to track and see which way its going
     
  2. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Yes your drain company should have cctv to look in the pipework, if they didn't they're not very good.

    Someone like dyno rod will have the right equipment but it won't be cheap.

    If your house is Victorian, try your local council, if the house is pre 1937 i think they have to sort out blocked drains free of change, not sure with yours being a convert though as some of the pipeeork will be post 37.
     
  3. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Might be a collapsed pipe, or tree roof causing obstruction.
     
  4. Jitender

    Jitender Screwfix Select

    Didn't have a manhole in my Victorian house.

    The waste ran out to the alleyway, where a mini sewer line was.

    Dyno rod can CCTV the pipework, there cameras can only go down 4" pipe.

    When I had a CCTV, the guy cut an access on the stack (50mm hole) and jetted through here for about 1/2 hour. Then camera was put down using screen, the display only gives the distance in meters the bore has traveled,not the direction it is traveling in.

    there were a few roots, nothing major all pipes were fine and hadn't settled.

    Used a different attachment on jet wash (root ball cutter) to cut roots - more finer powerful spray.

    A lot of cos record the images onto a CD or USB stick.
     
  5. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Some cctv now have a location transmitter on them, which you can follow on surface with a reciever, very handy, can save a lot of digging.
     
  6. zak99

    zak99 Member

    Thanks guys, it was Dynarod that came out. I wasnt there, the owner upstairs was and I think the theory was the CCTV was no use if the pipe was full of poop??

    The house is definitely pre 1937 and yes a conversion. This drain is original victorian though. Might be worth a call to the council but I'm not optimistic of them helping or taking any responsibility. Not really any trees in the area but interesting about roots seen on the CCTV as some years back, maybe 2 years there was a lot of creeping roots over the garden and the tree was destroyed because of it.

    KIAB thanks, one of those CCTV with a transmitter would be ideal, any idea who has them.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2016
  7. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

  8. zak99

    zak99 Member

    Thanks Kiab. I wonder how deep they scan.

    Where would we stand please if we found the drain were to go in the direction of the neighbours built over manhole? I havnt seen it but I believe there's a kitchen floor over it, no access. No idea what construction.

    I think the drain co were pulling out some wet wipe sheets at 4m length rod with a screw end on.

    He guessed from feel it went toward the neighbour.
    The Thames Water guy (a young un) said no it dont!!!

    When the drain guy jetted he felt in his view that the pipe was coiling up in a manhole.

    All guesswork and conflicting of course.
     
  9. kiaora

    kiaora Guest

  10. zak99

    zak99 Member

    Yes that figures thanks. Thames water were saying as only the upstairs flat has a problem. Ie downstairs and neighbour ok it's private drain.

    Still have the vague possibility that access via the neighbours covered manhole might have sorted it.
     
  11. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Flexitrace was the name I was trying to think of last night, it's a flexible cable with a integrated sonde attached, you use with a CAT & Genny to trace pipes, around 2 mtrs, the newer CAT 4 & Genny4 up to 4mtrs locating depth, but this depends on ground conditions.
    There is also a mouse which is a self contained SONDE which attaches to drain rods,,sure it's still used.

    http://www.cwplant.co.uk/shop/1112

    http://www.red-survey.co.uk/product/flexitrace/30-237.aspx

    Some of the CAT 4's have GPS/GNSS mapping function software as well.

    EDIT: Mouse still used & can be hired from some tool hire shops.:eek:
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2016
  12. zak99

    zak99 Member

    Thanks Kiab, very useful.

    Out of interest re CCTV survey and pipes full of poop. How do the camera co's deal with that, they must face this all the time. I suppose a reliable sucker is probably too big to go down any distance..
     
  13. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    If the problem is found to be under your neighbour's property, then your going to have another problem as how to solve your orginal problem.:rolleyes:

    I saw a similar situation manys years ago, neighbour built extension using a block & beam floor over a manhole, drain blocked, lid lifted & filled the void.:)
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2016
    zak99 likes this.
  14. sospan

    sospan Screwfix Select

    Without seeing the property it is difficult to say but the drainguy only rodding to 4m seems a bit short. If he was pulling wet wipes out going towards neighbour then problem seems to have originated your side ?
     
  15. Rulland

    Rulland Screwfix Select

    $h!t happens:rolleyes:
     
  16. zak99

    zak99 Member

    Oh yuk. Still battling on with this. New Drain co came and tried rodding (with springs on drill) up to 8 metres. No go.
    Came back next day with a 2 man jetter. Tried Camera down first but could only get about 2-3m before stopping at hard obstruction. But cant really see as pipe full of porridge !!
    Tried jetter for ages with both straight jet and backwash nozzle, twisting all the while and pulling it back and then back in. At one stage had close to 30m hose down, thats a lot of hose.
    At some point lots and lots of brown porridge started coming back up and we were hopeful, but no the water would still not run away.
    Tried camera again and this time thing we see a couple of sections of pipe at 2-3m out of line or down. (On screen Can see the arc of pipe at top in void)

    One theory is that the jet hose has exited the pipe if broken and is pulling through dirt.

    Also that a manhole may be in pipe path due to the way the water is going away slowly (!??)

    They tried the Sonde tracer and that got past the 2-3m obstruction and we were able to trace the path about 5m (until stopped again) towards the neighbours back gardens. No relevant manholes found anywhere !!!

    Monday its down to digging out the obstruction maybe failed pipe at 2-3 metres and taking it from there.

    Nightmare.
     
  17. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    When you dig the hole, watch out that the **** doesn't force it's way out the broken pipe & fill that hole you in, quicker than you can exit the hole...:eek::rolleyes:
    Otherwise your waist deep in ****:D
     
  18. zak99

    zak99 Member

    Well a little further forward. So many red herrings and wild goose chases !!

    Although its cost a small fortune so far the drain guy has worked hard. Today the blockage was freed via digging out first sunken pipe section and then persistant high pressure jetting. So camera was more useful now clearer and we could still see a lot of debris up the 6 inch bore clay pipe. Also able to roughly work out the path from looking at bends on the screen. Will nail it down more tomorrow.

    So a question. After the initial Drain Co came, Thames Water were called and a young lad came and strutted about and said no its private drain, nothing to do with us.

    Well it looks likely that the 6 inch clay pipe does go out of our boundary and along a cobbled path that is shared access to the rear of shops. Am I right that if a pipe leaves our boundary it will be Thames Waters responsibilty. It looks like the blockage was out of boundry and problems exist from the camera view with that cobbled path pipe, holes, sunken sections holding pools and rubble.

    I've call TW back, do I have a case for reimbursement for the small fortune we spent??

    TW were at one of those shops apparently a week before our blockage, jetting, sucking and rodding all night. Hmmmm.
     
  19. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Did TW accidentally block your pipe clearing out the other ?????
     
    KIAB likes this.
  20. Mr. Handyandy

    Mr. Handyandy Screwfix Select


    Most likely.

    Refund is the order of the day.

    Mr. HandyAndy - Really
     

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