No, I can read. As can you. What I was hoping from you was to read, digest, understand, engage critical faculties and then post what you truly believe the case to be. Put your political integrity on the line in your own words. Not 'link and run'. But you never ever do this. So, I'll help you by explaining what I did. First, I had to ignore the 'quotation marks' in the Express's heading, since it doesn't go on to say who 'spoke' these words (Brussels 'orders Britain to pay £700MILLION to crumbling superstate' in leaked memo). I then ignored the "crumbling superstate" moniker as that highlights (a) the Express's staggering bias and (b) the staggering awful quality of their reporting. Then I tried to look at the facts. It appears (but correct me if I'm wrong) that the reason we are paying an 'extra' £700m now is that we paid less at the start of the year. Did you expect that, Phil?! I also see that our contributions WILL now go up significantly because they are paid in Euros and the £ has fallen as a direct result of the Brexit vote - so well done you. Leavers have inadvertently increased our bill to the EU. Oh the painful irony. The same unfortunate release of info also warns that the government is “unlikely to bring deficit reduction entirely back on track” and that the “continuing run of disappointing data” meant there was a “severe worsening in the public finances”. “For the year to date the deficit is £2.3bn lower than last year; at a fall of 4.8%, well behind the 27.0% reduction forecast,” the document says. Again, largely (if not solely?) as a direct result of the Brexit vote. We are truly stuffed. See? That's what I mean by putting (biased) reporting into your own words; simply posting links is far too easy. And potentially dishonest.
??????? We're leaving so the bill will be zero so a short term Increase if there is one will be just that , short term. As for a deficit, after all the cut backs the boy George did, devastating many people's lives, he still borrowed more than any chancellor before him.
Watch this and tell me she's wrong, forget what you may or may not think of her or any right wing party, just take in what shes saying, Re: looking out for your country.
You'll have to forgive me, Phil, if I delay watching a video of the French national front leader until I am truly bored. I choose who I listen to more carefully, not someone who makes pernicious and scurrilous claims for pure populist political gain - I see she's peddling the "Islamic law is going to take over French law" pile of bull as well. Really, Phil... In any case, I did your job for you on your last post (you haven't thanked me yet, by the way...) and you haven't responded in any way to it apart from a typical glib throw-away. (I'm chust waiting for Mr Ha, Scott, Harry et al to 'like' it... ) This is just tooo sad. It is heartbreakingly tragic. Britain, what have you become?
Typical, think you know what's going on before you've even seen it, pretend you've never heard of her and listen as if its the first time you've seen her, then tell us it doesn't make sense.
DA, you seem to have lost your way in the debate; slating people on the other side of the argument is a sign that you've lost the argument, and don't call me or anyone else a fascist if you don't know. In answer to your point about the politicians; at least they had the integrity to stand up for what they believe in when they knew that if remain won they would be kicked out of their jobs. I have a lot of time for people who put the country first. Just look at a few examples of how the EU has stifled our economy and put people out of work: Cadbury owned by Kraft, moved a factory to Poland with EU grant. Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant. Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant. Peugeot closed its Ryton plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant. British Army's new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in Spain using Swedish steel at the request of the EU, to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales. Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan. Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200. M&S manufacturing gone to Far East with EU loan. Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with EU grants. Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant. Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant. Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant. Sekisui Alveo declared production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding. Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing. ICI integration into AkzoNobel with EU bank loan and within days of the merger, several factories in the UK were closed, eliminating 3,500 jobs Boots sold to Italian Stefano Pessina who based their HQ in Switzerland to avoid tax to the tune of £80 million a year, using an EU loan for the purchase. JDS Uniphase run by two Dutchmen, bought up companies in the UK with £20 million in EU 'regeneration' grants, created a pollution nightmare and just closed it all down leaving 1,200 out of work and an environmental clean-up paid for by the UK tax-payer. They also raided the pension fund and drained it dry. Thanks EU David Cameron's remain campaign bus was made in Germany even though we have Plaxton, Optare, Bluebird, Dennis etc., in the UK. All those loans and grants have been partly paid for by British taxpayers of course. Things are looking good for the UK post Brexit, even Martin Sorrell, head of the advertising giant WPP and who campaigned vigorously to remain, now says that “things are perking up” Rule Britannia! All that was pre Brexit and if that won't convince you that Brexit is a good thing, wait for a year or so and you'll see that it's the best move the British electorate ever made.
Looks like DA will get some first hand experience of migration, let's hope they are grateful for the help. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-37744012
Britain what have you become is right! Britain, what will you 'now' become is better! Britain will rise from the ashes of the EU to be stronger, independent. A force to be reckoned with!!! No more a slave of the EU.
Perhaps DA could justify each one of these, sentence by sentence just for me, here's your chance. Mr. HandyAndy - Really
Well I think Harry Stottle comprehensively destroyed your argument that it's just about the only "potentially legitimate" political point DA (a few posts ago) You poor misguided fool.
What's typical, Phil, is that you post links and run away. And fail to respond to my simple request - put your words out here for us to look at. Sate your claim - like in your previous two articles - so we can see where you really are.
Irony doesn't even begin... The sheer hypocrisy and dishonesty. Harry, its time for you to stand head and shoulders above your sidekicks Phil and Mr Ha. This is what YOU need to do: Rewrite that list of claims in OUR words. Don't cut and paste. State them as FACTS that YOU believe in. Place your reputation on this forum on them. Then I will come back and answer you - like I have Phil in his press reports above. C'mon, Harry - THIS SHOULD BE EASY FOR YOU. If you really believe it.
I honestly find it a bit scary how otherwise normally-functioning peeps can nevertheless delude themselves so comprehensively on some issues. This is honestly frightening. (I'm pretty sure I do understand the reasons why, but that just makes it worse.) They post 'stuff' and then run away shouting over their shoulders "Hah - answer that!!!! Funurrrr..." Ok, this is what I'll do, folks... If anyone here would like to post an assertion - a truly worked-out, personally-believed assertion - then I'll do my best to answer it. For example, Phil posted (#196) a couple of links to newspaper articles, clearly trying to 'make a point'. But what he abjectly failed to do is claim these points in his own words as being 'fact'. Or what he, himself, truly believes. What I mean is, any twit can post a link, but if you really wish it to make a political point, then you need to make the point yourself. Claim it to be fact, as you understand it. Otherwise it's cheap and completely pointless. So, in post #201 I pointed out what I did to examine Phil's facile post. His only response (#202) was to say 'We'll pay zero when we leave!!'. In other words, he wouldn't back up his scurrilous 'link' claims. That, to me, implies cowardice, or ignorance, or laziness, or a strong realisation of being wrong. Show us that you've read something, analysed it, examined it critically and are then happy to post it as SOMETHING YOU BELIEVE! If you do that, I will do my darnedest to answer it. Otherwise, it's worthless. Phil, Mr Ha, JJ and Harry. Any fool can chust post a link and kid themselves they've made a point. But you ain't kidding anyone on here (other than, of course, the 'usual suspects' who give no consideration to the actual veracity of a post). The same with Mr Ha - in post #190 he made some of his typical 'open' claims of why he wanted 'out'. I asked him to simply give me some examples, and he went quiet. Again, that implies to me either cowardice, ignorance, laziness or an acceptance of being wrong. (And then he became rude in post #209... ) And the very best is Harry's 'cut-and-paste' post (#206). (He even had Mr Ha asking me to respond to them as if they had value... Cheap, Mr Ha, cheap). In post #213 I asked Harry to simply put these claims into his own words. In other words, before I respond, come on here and state that these are things you actually, truly believe. That these are issues you are happy to stake your credibility on. Because, if you don't believe them, then don't expect anyone else to have to answer them. Don't expect anyone to consider them as anything other than complete bull. And, finally, there is Phil (again... after having side-stepped my request to put his newspaper articles in to issues he believes are true.) Having not learned anything from the example I gave him (I mean, having side-stepped the responsibility) on how to test the veracity of a 'link', he goes on to post a video (from a Le Pen...) and expects me to examine it... I'll make a deal with you, Phil - you look through that vid again and post on here any claim made by Le Pen that you believe is relevant and factual. Claim them as your own true beliefs, and I'll come back and do my best to answer them - and I will acknowledge any points that could well be 'factual' (after all, not even Farage tells complete fibs all of the time...) Until you silly lot do this - put your mouths and integrity where your cheap 'linked' claims are - don't believe for a second that you are kidding anyone on here that you are making an honest or valid point. (You will have observed that only your fellow suspects 'like' your posts, 'cos misery sure do love company)
If you truly believe this, JJ, then ALL you have to do is go through Harry's list and post them on here as issues YOU also believe to be true. C'mon, JJ, post these claims as yours. Then I'll do my best to come back and answer them. This is incredibly easy to do - all you have to do is start a post with "I, JJ, truly believe, to the best of my critical judgement, the following issues to be factual and I stake my political reputation on this forum on them..." And then simply 'cut and paste' Harry's list.
So you very much EXPECT me to give examples of my wishes, yet when asked to justify Harry's statement of FACT, you absolutely refuse. Hypocrite. While we are on the subject, I very rarely post excerpts or links to, but if I were to find someone on the internet sharing my views, I would gladly post it, and YOU should take it as though that was what I believe in too. Are you stupid? Why would anyone post a link or excerpt that they don't believe in? You should try it someday, instead of trying to put it into your own words, which generally come out as hypocritical, condescending and outright rude. We are all entitled to our own opinion, be it expressed in our own words, or those of others that may put it better. Just remember DA, as much as you think we are stupid, the thought is reciprocated back towards yourself in even greater belief.. you are stupid and you know it. Now where is your reply to the post about all the companies listed as helped away from the UK by the EU? It's disgraceful, as are you. Mr. HandyAndy - Really
There is absolutely no reason to follow up any links with words of our own, the fact we post links is enough to suggest we agree with the said links, its only you who like reading their own voice and some how has to justify the rubbish you write. Do you honestly believe that every link we've posted to be a fictitious load of nonsense written by peeps who no nothing, or is it as it appears, that because its not your view its wrong. My personal view is that within the next 5 years we will be seen as the country with the foresight to have gotten out the failed EU, while those that stayed will be struggling to stay afloat after the collapse of the Euro, this will ultimately see Germany and France being outcast by the remaining countries possibly leading to civil wars, would i blame the UK for this, absolutely not, those to blame are in power now, you don't need me to tell you who they are.
So what? Do you think Brexit will stop companies moving? Do you think it will prevent them getting loans to move to low wage economies? Perhaps you think it'll stop countries offering incentives to move? Do you think Brexit turns back the tide of globalization? You voted for Brexit, not time travel back to the 1950s. I get it. You don't think all European decisions helped Britain. But who's making that argument? It'd be crazy if anyone agreed with 100% of anything or thought that all decisions would always be in Britain's favour. The world of commerce is now more networked than it has ever been. Fortress EU was getting battered and we've managed to leave even its meagre protection. God save our gracious pound. Next time you copy/paste posts from your facebook friends, you might want append your own reasoned economic arguments or at least weigh the strength of the argument you're plagiarizing. Where's the nutty Illuminati/lizard people dude gone? At least he wrote his own material.
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