Leaky loo ...... Unusual design ?

Discussion in 'Plumbers' Talk' started by DIYDave., Jun 27, 2017.

  1. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    Hi all
    Firstly, let me say that this loo is in a workshop on an industrial unit that belongs to a mate of mine - so not totally pristine due to the location

    Anyway, I help him out with a bit of maintenance / diy from time to time. The toilet is in two parts (unusual to me) and is leaking from the join

    My mate says just wack some silicon around the join (but he is a total bodger when it comes to maintenance jobs)

    I would rather separate the two parts, clean thoroughly and reseal and join. Don't want to replace the toilet as don't want to get involved with breaking out old porcelain and joining to cast collar

    My questions are -

    Best way to separate two sections

    What are they likely to be sealed with

    What to make new join / seal with

    Floor is being pulled up as it's painted laminate which has had it and walls will get a lick of paint. It's a workshop not a palace but leak needs sorting and tidying up

    Any help / advise gratefully received guys - thanks
     

    Attached Files:

    KIAB likes this.
  2. koolpc

    koolpc Super Member

    Its on a wall!!!! :p
     
  3. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Old S trap pan, it might be fitted into a clay pipe socket.

    Cut your loses & fit a new pan, a lot easier than trying to get a perfect seal.

    BUT, Stixall or Plumbers Gold sealant might work.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2017
  4. nigel willson

    nigel willson Screwfix Select

    Never seen one of them. However from what I can see they've made it in two parts so that you can change the angel of connection. Would imagine it needs pulling apart and reselling. BUT May break when doing this, so new one with different set up for waste as they are different now!
     
  5. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    I have.:)

    It's known as a ROTAS 2 PART S TRAP WC, & they ain't cheap.

    A Shires one below.

    upload_2017-6-27_21-30-17.jpeg

    And a linky, there fitting instructions as well: https://www.hmjames.co.uk/products/...wls/shires/replacement+rotas+2+part+s+trap+wc
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2017
  6. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    Cheers guys;

    Loo is definatly fitted on the floor kools, pic rotated corect way on my phone

    Want to leave S trap and collar alone and separate actual toilet bowl from base (if possible),clean up and reseal

    Guessing joint is made using some form of putty / plumbers mait ?

    Not over confident in tackling this job. The grime doesn't worry me as I'm totally not screamish and actually enjoy cleaning and fixing things. Plus will get looked after by my mate

    The loo doesn't even smell 'pishy' it's mainly water that is leaking, especially when flushed. High level cistern so loads of gravity and force when the chain is yanked !
     
  7. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    I always wear latex gloves, when working on toilets.
     
  8. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Look at my linky for joining instructions, they use sand & cement to join on outside & silicone sealant for internal joint.

    But, I reckon a modern sealant as mention in earlier reply would be better.
    Do the joint after your mate has finished work, will give sealant overnight or over weekend to dry properly.

    https://www.hmjames.co.uk/images_products_original/Web_Tech_Info/rotas.pdf
     
  9. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    Thanks all for the input so far

    Nigel - yep realise the loo is in 2 parts and separating them, cleaning, then resealing is my plan
    Want to leave the S Trap and Collar well alone as will turn in to a much bigger job than I want. If the bowl can be separated from the trap section, then happy days :)

    Kiab (The Linkmaster) Many thanks, that's very helpful

    If sealed with silicon or even putty, then I may have a chance to separate
    If sand and cement has also been used - then no chance I guess :eek:
     
  10. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Many years since I've seen one, but the external sand/cement joint should come apart quite easily, gentle persuasion might help,you say it's leaking,so joint as already parted, internal joint seal shouldn't be a problem either.

    The pan might just lift away from base leaving cement fillet in place, stuff rag down pipe to prevent cement disappearing down it, before removing it.

    Very unlikely to be a putty.
     
  11. fillyboy

    fillyboy Screwfix Select

    So do I, where I go wrong is forgetting to take them orf when I stop for me sandwich.

    I would have thought twisting back and forth would free the joints, but yeah, 40 year old putty, it will be hard. I think the old school solution would be plumbers mait in the joint which I would prefer in that instance to silicone, but, wasn't there an earlier method using hemp string/rope?, depends on how much play once the crud is cleaned off. We need a plumber older than KIAB's horse to answer this one.
     
  12. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    They are quite clear in the instructions, sand/cement external joint & silicone for internal joint, they never were joined with hemp & mastic.

    Plumbers Gold (from TS) should join it, whereas Plumbers Mait is a non setting mastic & so no good.

    http://www.everbuild.co.uk/plumbers-gold
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017
  13. nigel willson

    nigel willson Screwfix Select

  14. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    A few pennies short of £300.:eek:

    http://www.colouredbathrooms.co.uk/wc-toilet-pan.html

    [​IMG]

    In above photo you can clearly see cement fillet, I'm amazed the toilet is still available, last one I seen was nearly 30 years ago,& it had been in use for probably 30 years then, so it's a old design,I do wonder if they actually sell any nowadays.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017
  15. koolpc

    koolpc Super Member

    crappy price!
     
  16. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Even second hand in very good or perfect condition they can fetch several hundred pounds.
     
  17. koolpc

    koolpc Super Member

    It was a joke my dear friend
     
  18. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Well aware it was Kools, I always keep a lookout for old toilets like the rota, they make you money.:)
     
  19. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    Managed to pop over for a couple of hours today to look at loo, also lifted laminate floor as was rotten

    Gave the loo a quick clean over and flushed several times to try and see where it was leaking from

    The S bend has a fine hairline crack around the complete circumference of it which you can just see in the photo. It's clearly leaking from here on every flush - so looking at a new toilet

    As mentioned, this style is silly money so hoping to replace with a 'big standard' :))) loo

    Couple of issues are connecting the toilet to the waste in the floor as it's clearly gonna need some engineering

    Waste from floor is glazed clay with toilet waste cemented in

    Any further help would be greatly appreciated guys - many thanks for your time
     

    Attached Files:

  20. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Post 3, I said replace ithe toilet,the floor, is it concrete.

    You need to cut off clay socket to start with.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017

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