Hi, We have an area in the bathroom that has already been plasterboarded, skimmed and painted. This area will now have a shower tray in and be tiled in slate. I had a tiler round who said it was fine to tile over as it is. After reading about weights and backerboard etc i told him i was worried and he came back and said it didnt need boarding and that it would take the weight of the tiles. The weight of the slate is 26kg/m2. Im unsure now what to do - my other half says we should trust him. But im worried and we are already halfway thru the plumber doing his stuff so are left with no sink or shower etc. I also dont feel competent enough to fit any tile boards myself so was hoping the tiler would say yes it needed it and would fit if we supplied! Do i find another tiler or just let him do what he wants as hes the professional - ive just read forums!?
Get ANOTHER tiler in. 26kg slate Adhesive/grout per metre =4kg (approx) So you will be 1/3rd over weight as it is. That's without taking into account the "Painted walls" Gypsum Plaster 20Kg/m² Gypsum Plasterboard Direct (without a plaster skim) 32Kg/m² Plywood (WBP) Up to 30Kg/m² Lightweight Tilebacking Boards* Up to 40Kg/m². Dependant upon the type and thickness of the board. Glass reinforced Cement Sheets Up to 50kg/m², Dependant upon the type and thickness of the board. Gypsum Fibre boards Approximately 35- 40Kg/m²
My gut says I need to get another one in. I've just no idea with a week to go how to let him know without him not getting angry! Normally who's responsibility is it to put up boards ready for tiling? I'd guess a tiler as then he knows they are done right? Or the plumber? Plus now getting in a new one it's going to be a case that we have just a bath for a few weeks .
The first question is who decided on the physical construction of the shower cubicle and are you going to be using such things as a tanking system behind the slate and are these glazed slate tiles or need sealing ? If you are worried about the tiler getting angry even before the job starts it is best to get shot now
The shower cubicle was already there (not as a shower) as a storage area so was only skimmed. Its now being made into a shower years later. So from what I've read I know it needs something more. Backerboard say it doesn't need tanking. I can use in skimmed plaster board and tank or aquapanel. I'm not bothered what as long as it right and safe, but im unsure who decides what to put up and who does it. I'm worried he's gonna get annoyed as it's a week to go and being self employed suppose it's not nice being g cancelled last minute ( he presumes he's tiling correct) so won't understand why I'm cancelling- especially coming from a non tiler telling him he's not doing it correct. But for peace of mind I think I will have to just cancel and hope to get another in quickly.
It's always an awkward moment, Robbo - when you feel you have to tell a pro how to do his job. Some will react as they should - "Hmm, ok - fair point. I'm sure, based on experience, that it would be ok doing it the way I said, but you want it done 100% by the book - absolutely no problem. It's important the customer gets the job he wants." Others will take it as an affront to their expertise, be tetchy and defensive and try and suggest you are questioning their superior judgement - something that should seemingly be beyond reproach. Some will even bleat about the 'breakdown in trust' betwixt the customer and 'pro'; "I can't work under these conditions!" Guess which one should get the job? First, I DON'T KNOW if the tiles will be too heavy for that wall - I simply don't have that knowledge. I suspect it's as Ghost says; it's a third over-weight - but the chances are it'll be fine, as these sorts of figures have to take in to account worst case scenarios such as quality of work, quality of products used etc. It's actually very rare for professionally-fitted tiles to come crashing off a wall, and even more so for the p'board to fall off under the weight! But, that doesn't mean it's the 'right' way to do it. And, by using slate,it sounds as tho' you are going for a fancy, reasonably costly, job? So, in your position, I'd want it done 'right'. How to broach the matter? You've already mentioned the issue, so it won't come out of the blue. You need to be upfront; disarming but assertive - "Look, I have to be honest; I'm still concerned about the tile weight on this wall. Everything I've read (show the guy some figures) tells me it's taking a chance - it's over the weight limit. You must hate people like me who get their info from the 'net! I fully accept that you know what you are doing and you are confident it'll be fine, but I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to relax, thinking I'd need to take more care in the shower instead of just going in there and relaxing. I'll probably be paranoid, checking the tiles every time I'm having a shower! I'd be much happier with proper backing-board being used first, although I know it'll cost more." If the guy huffs and puffs over any of this perfectly reasonable request, then he's simply not a 'pro'; he is more interested in rescuing his own ego than what the customer wants. I repeat, tho' - I don't know anything about the technical issues of this. If your tiler is adamant that it'll be fine, then the onus is on him to prove it with manufacturer's figures - just like Ghost has done above. And keep all that info in case you have to sue his *** a few years down the line...
If the shower area was skimmed, why was it plaster boarded ? was the wall uneven. When the plasterboard was fixed, was it dot and dab or fixed to battens ? With these tiles you are going to need a top notch tiler as you do not want grout or adhesive on the surface as they will be ruined Sorry for all the questions but with tiling you only get one go at it and we don't want you wasting money by having them fall off or get spoilt.
Thanks for the reply. Helpful post. And yeah its not a cheap job! haha So think it needs to be done right yes. I will speak to him now!
No your right i dont want them falling off! The area was part of another room that we had built a stud wall in. It was a bathroom with two doors so we basically created a storage room off one door. So the board was screwed to a wooden baton frame. It was then skimmed just to look better to paint. It was then used as a storage area for towels etc. Annoyingly if we had know we were going to have it as a shower we could have used proper board instead but hindsight!
That makes it quite easy then. I would remove the plasterboard and then Pop along to your builders merchant, b&Q or wickes and get some backer panel and have that screwed onto the wall. Also get a seal to fit underneath the tiles at the bottom so any water doesn't run backwards under the tile / board. One thing to remember is that the cement board do allow some moisture to wick through to the back so an air gap is quite useful. The other thing to consider when the plasterboard is off is to make sure you have a batten where you want the shower screen to fix to. Some panels are quite heavy and need a secure fixing and it is much easier to do this now. Around £100 for boards, joint tape, screws and channel should give you peace of mind. With the stud work in place it is probably a mornings work at most to fit the panels.
No problem, We just like to see things done properly. I don't think many people understand how frustrating / upsetting it for us when we turn up to a household and there are botched jobs and quite oftern have to tell the family all that money they spent will end up in landfill
Definitely reboard with cement backer board, but remember, some of these backer boards are ONLY water resistant.......not waterproof. If you think about it, this tiler is happy to tile onto a "painted, 2-3mm skim of plaster. On their own (paint/skim) should not be tiled onto with these tiles......but definitely NOT tiled onto both of these surfaces. Also, these backer boards are as mentioned heavy, so you will probably need to add a few noggins to stiffen the wall. Sorry to P on your chips.
Well i didnt understand why he thought he could , im not a tiler but the info is out there! And ok thanks for the extra info.
Right had a couple of tilers come in and need more advice! Both would be happy to tile on skimmed plaster walls! i said i was going to board in with hardibacker. They both then said all the walls are uneven and would need boarding and to reduce cost that waterproof plasterboard was ok in areas not getting wet and they would pva.-have i read no to pva somewhere??!! Or is ther a waterproof pva thats ok ?
First off there is no such thing as waterproof plasterboard. There is water "resistant" board, however, even this will break down if wet continuously. Cement board is semi porous but won't break down. The green water resistant plasterboard will be fine in areas where it is not going to get very wet. However, you still have the issue of the tile weight on plasterboard. From your earlier posts you mentioned that the walls have already been plaster boarded are these new tilers saying what was done was not good enough ?
No only the shower area was plasterboarded and skimmed. The other walls had tiles on and when removed the walls werent in a good state. the old tiler was going to tile over the walls - some were bare stone I think some were this grey material(old house no idea what it is). I was so concerned with him happy to tile the shower area i never question the other walls as he said they were ok! The two other tilers ive had in have said they too would tile over the skimmed plasterboard shower area but i insisted on the hardibacker. which they were fine with. But they have said the other walls need boarding too and yes sorry was the green plasterboard that would be pva'd. sorry all a bit confusing! So if we use green plasterboard is it primed or tanked? Is there any chance a pva prime is ok? Or is itok on its own?
Honestly, If you are going to the expense of putting slate tiles, why worry about trying to save some money here and there? just get it battened, cement boarded and you know its the best start for your job. if the tilers then bodge it, there are no excuses
Forums
Facebook
Twitter
You Tube
Instagram
Shop