Soooooooo,

Discussion in 'Just Talk' started by Deleted member 33931, Apr 23, 2017.

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  1. I think you'll find we live in cynical times.

    Very cynical indeed.

    And this neatly brings me back to one of the issues I've peddled from day 1 - how stupid the electorate is. And that they cannot be trusted with issues as important as constitutional change. Or, frankly, referendums of any sort (at least not without a much high 'pass' mark.)

    Will ditching FN help Le Pen? Quite possibly. Quite probably. Should it help her? No, of course not - it shouldn't make any difference whatsoever; she's a slug in whatever party she calls herself - just as Farage is here.

    That is a statement of the bleedin' obvious. You'd have to be a numbskull to allow such a cynical move to influence you. But, there are lots of numbskulls around.

    And not chust on this forum.
     
  2. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    Intelligence isn't measured on a black and white scale of, been to university/haven't been to university. You don't require a degree in a 'narrow field of interest' to be intelligent.
    Just as you don't require a certificate from being a contestant on 'mastermind', to have an awareness of what is going on around you.
    These 'numbskulls' as you so effectionately label, are the very people who are at the front line of everything the EU has brought about. They are the ones who've seen their wages decline, their workmates replaced by foreign imports who have caused the wage decrease in the first place.
    Keep on calling them numbskulls why dontcha. Very effective
    Why do you think this current trend of extremes is happening?
    And, it won't stop just because, le-pen doesn't win the presidency. It will only grow stronger for next time around.
    The global recession has ended, quite a while ago too, so you can't really use that as a convenient excuse. It won't wash.

    The problem exists because the centrist establishment refuse to listen. They have essentially created their own rock and hard place, too afraid of criticism from both the left and the right.

    If you can't see that, then you're not as intelligent as you make out.

    Said the cynic.:rolleyes:
     
    SWBUILDERS likes this.

  3. No surprise that SW likes this .

    Longs, what you said makes an awful lot of sense. I agree, people have seen wages decrease and the establishment refuses to listen.

    And then you go and support the very people you complain about. That is what DA means about intelligence. It isn't about being degree educated, or having a high IQ, it is about basic sense.

    Say and recognise what the problem is, and then go and support more of it.

    It is why SW's liking of the post doesn't surprise me.

    Simply put, if you don't like how the establishment is crushing the ordinary person, why do you want more of it?
     
    Deleted member 33931 likes this.
  4. Too many words there, Longs, to say next-to-nothing at all.

    And to try and blame the EU for the world-wide financial crash. Which we all know is what actually caused the pain felt by the worst-off in our society. Coupled with your Tory party's subsequent policy.

    Man, Farage has fed you your lines well.

    (And of course SW 'likes' this!)
     
  5. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select


    So the establishment wanted Brexit, ok as long as we know.
     
  6. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select


    Who do you blame than.????
     

  7. Yes, exactly.

    Who else, apart from those that have been hoodwinked ?
     
  8. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    SWBUILDERS wants out of the EU, so yeah, I'm not surprised either.

    I'm not supporting the establishment, the eu 'is the establishment' and it's relentless drive towards a federal Europe is one of the main reasons why I voted to leave. The freedom of movement policy is another one of my biggies.
    You see, I haven't voted for anyone, yet.
    But I will be voting conservative in the coming election (I live in a 'safe' Labour constituency so it will probably be fruitless, but you never know) as they have the best chance of delivering a proper brexit.
    Jeez, I would even vote for Corby if I thought he could deliver.
     
  9. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    You know I didn't blame the EU for the crash, what a bonkers thing to say, DA.

    There's always been a healthy amount of euroscepticism within the UK. Referendums have been promised many times before and come to now't, this was our one chance for the people to have a say and the majority voted out. The crash was almost a decade ago and yes it probably played at least some small part in people's decision, but the main thrust stems from the 'lefts' obsession to control our lives and thoughts. Many, are sick and tired of being dictated to.
    Liberalism, my aris.
    Capitalism, with a communists twist is what it is.
     
  10. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    Can you define your image of the 'establishment'?
     
  11. fillyboy

    fillyboy Screwfix Select

  12. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    :D
    Very good.
    I'm surprised you've conceded defeat in such an ostentatious manner, tho.
    Not like you, at all.:rolleyes:
     
  13. Your wishful thinking neffer ends :)

    But, fair do's - when you out-Phil Phil, then it's time to say byeeeeeee.
     
    Deleted member 164349 likes this.

  14. Yes, its the perennial view of establishment too.

    Right wing, well off, mostly from money but not always. Business owners or advisers. Position of power, able to manipulate.

    Good with words, able to make radical statements sound good, by avoiding the depth of an argument and just promoting a headline.

    Mostly tory, but not exclusive. But certainly profiting by manipulation of money, for profit or power.

    Examples. Farage, May, Cameron, Osbourne, Davies, Johnson and their less well known but just as right wing backers, and the fat cat big business leaders. Plus those generally unnamed, but powerful mandarins, controlling the minds of many.

    Is your mind controlled? No, of course it isn't, you always vote Tory, so there is no control needed?

    You think the establishment is different ?
     
    Deleted member 33931 likes this.
  15. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    Keeping digging if you want to, no skin off my nose, but I'd rather you didn't. Honestly.

    Ok, carry on.
    If you must.;)
    I must say I'm disappointed tho.
    I expected better from you than the all to easy universal shame card tactic that you've chosen.
    Hey ho. Another day.
     
  16. JoT said it perfectly in post #55.


    Manipulation by the establishment - acted on by hoards of mindless minions...

    Who then go on to try and defend the establishment. Whilst denying it is the establishment.

    You couldn't make it up.

    I can certainly understand your reluctance to accept you've been conned.

    There, that better, Longs?

    You are very welcome.
     
  17. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    Thanks.
    It's refreshing to see that you've clarified in black and white what I've always assumed you meant by 'establishment'.
    In many ways you are right, it does tend to be those who have wealth, and therefore power, that define the establishment.
    That's just the way it's always been, for obvious reasons.
    However, the fact that an individual or organisation has such wealth and power doesn't mean that they 'are' the establishment by default, the simple act of pressing for a change to the normal running of things makes them different from the establishment. You could call them 'anti-establishment' to be correct.

    The, EU is the epitome of the 'norm', those who are challenging it's position are not.
    You see what I mean?

    Oh, by the way, I've never voted tory in my life. I will be in a few weeks though.
     
  18. No? Really? UKIP then?

    Of course you will.

    That way you can pretend to yourself you knew what you were doing with Brexit all along - oh, such conviction.

    Your wishful thinking clearly extends to trying to convince others as much as yourself.

    I am not convinced, Longs. I see you now as no different to Phil. And JJ. And 'arry.
     
  19. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    We've all been conned, DA.
    Some have finally woken up to the fact, that's all.
    Stay in your midden if it gives you solace.
     
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