To power flush or not?

poor bloke,

I'm sorry & I hope I'm wrong,

Sounds like you have a boiler fitted to a dirty system

 

I'm confused ! I'm not a plumber, but where does Hydrogen come into this? If it's a rusting steel radiator, then Ferrous Oxide (rust) is produced, where does H2 come from?

 

He does seem to be trying his best..

 

Sorry I didn't read previous comments,

Assumed it was a new system

In my opinion, your system condition should of been evaluated 1st,
Then if sludge is present, I would of advised a system cleanser and power flush or a simple drain & flush various times until the water was clear, it's down to the plumber to ensure the cheapest but equally effective method of obtaining the desired result depending on condition, the rads in my opinion would be advised to be changed but it's your money your choice, a magna clean is advised for the boiler protection and warranty safe guard,

 

Very rustily if you have Fe and H2O you produce FeO and H2 ish

 

I'm not sure but iron oxide creates it,
If I wanted a chemistry lesson id watch breaking bad

 

I feel sorry for both party's,

He's trying his best to resolve the situation

The client has had a not so perfect install but has not complained about anything else

He needs to learn from this as all good plumbers have learnt

The client needs to be happy at the end of the day

Resolve the problem buddy, you caused it

 

The good news is that the plumber (although misguided) does seem willing to try and sort this. And his customer sounds like a very reasonable person, willing to allow him the opportunity.

OOokkkayyyy, these are assumptions: The system the plumber fitted a new condensing boiler to was old and pretty well corroded and sludged. Sludge and condensing boilers aren't happy bunnies together.

He made a perfunctory effort to remove the sludge by adding system cleaners and then presumably draining and washing out the system by probably sticking a hose at one end and draining off at the other.

This clearly wasn't anything like good enough - and there lies your problem. Your plumber did not do a proper install.

He also doesn't seem to have done anything to capture the considerable sludge that was left behind by fitting a filter, so any loose sludge just circulated around, causing all sorts of issues seemingly including blocking the one new radiator!

So, he was negligent so should feel obliged to sort this now with some enthusiasm...

The presence of hydrogen (thanks Chippie - I wasn't sure... ) suggests there is still corrosion taking place, which is astonishing considering the amount of inhibitor that he added! No idea how this can be - unless the sludge is soooo thick in the rads it's corroding away where it's in contact with the rad surface whilst being protected from the inhibitor by the thick sludge coating above it.

Sooooo, this will cost you a £ew hundred, Donna - but it should have cost you this in the first place, so it's nothing you wouldn't have spent anyways... (apart from the £300 to fit a pump and change some unnecessary pipework... )

Your choice, but this is what I would do.

Some (Most? All?) of your old rads are almost certainly heavily corroded and now thin-walled and coated with sludge. Radiators are not expensive - check our our hosts, Screwfix - so I'd be inclined to chuck away the oldest/most suspicious (like the bedroom ones) and fit new. That's a large amount of corrosion and sludge got rid off right there - whooppeeeee. And spanking new rads too - my cup runneth over...

Any that are not replaced should be removed and flushed through outside until they run clear. As much of the pipework should also be flushed through with a hose as far as possible.

A good quality filter (Magnclean, Fernox, Sentinel, etc) should then be fitted on the return and a double dose of Sentinel X900 added and the system run as normal, until very little further sludge is collected by the filter. Then system drained, hosed through and a dose of X100 (inhibitor) added along with a long-term cleaner such as X400 added.

All that should then be required is a 6-monthly clean of the filter to catch and remaining stuff.

If I had to spend the best part of £600 for a powerflush, then I'd rather spend it on new some rads instead.

How many really old rads do you have, Donna?

 

So you only need to replace 4 other rads - that sounds like the only way to go.

The only remaining sludge will be in the pipes, and a powerful cleaner like X800 should shift that over a couple of months - to be collected in a filter.

Rads are cheap. And a simple task for a plumber to fit. Worth looking at 'oversizing' if it isn't too much extra hassle/cost - in other words, don't just replicate the output of the old ones but choose higher output if possible, say by choosing ones with extra fins (convectors) etc. As long as they are not physically wider and would make fitting more complex.

The reason is, you could then turn your boiler's output down a bit so's it runs a bit cooler - this will make it more efficient in running and also cause less stress on the components. The 'larger' rads should still give the same heat output as the old ones (plus a bit more if needed in winter by cranking the boiler back up )

Does that make sense?

 

Cool - good luck, and please keep us posted

 

Nope, Worcester Bosch only insist on a chemical flush before fitting one of thier boilers, not a chemical flush. It's entirely up to the customer and doesn't impact on the guarantee. You're more likely to have guarantee problems for not using an accredited installer. At present, WB offer a guarantee, not a warranty.

 

I am not sure the OP is that interested 7 years later!

I skimmed the first few posts and got bored, but the plumber is clearly either in Compton a charlatan.

 

"So, you ask him - why didn't he recommend/carry out the power-flush/system clean before the new boiler was installed? Add that you understand Worcester won't guarantee their boilers without this."**********

That statement is not true. Worcester Bosch supply a Chemical flush kit and do not insist on a power flush to keep the guarantee valid. It is up to the customer, on the advice of the accredited installer. The chemical flush must be used ,but there is NO hard and fast rule over powerflushing. It may well be advised, but it is misleading to say that the guarantee is nullified. To double check on that statement, I have just talked to Worcester Bosch on the phone, who confirmed that a powerflush was not mandatory.