Discussion in 'Electricians' Talk' started by kirkdx, Jan 21, 2021.
Do the manufactures think you are in mainland Europe where the 16A Shuko plug is endemic?
That's the one I'm looking to get, assuming it's ever back in stock
Also, if I end up getting a new CU added for the garage/outside circuits, would you say it's better to get a ring for the 13a sockets, a radial (with a larger cable as 16a MCB doesn't seem enough for all the sockets) or 2+ radials split to different sockets?
In this case, I think the "trade" rating of it is the only reason it's got a 16A plug on!
I'm a production technician full-time (well, until Covid!) and a lot of stuff comes with a 16A plug as standard regardless of it's rating. For smaller gigs at venues where we don't supply our own distribution kit, they just get a 13-16A adaptor stuck on the end and it's straight into a wall socket.
Ring/Radials, doesn't matter really, if it's just you in there then you won't have multiple tools running at the same time. Just bear in mind whether you'll want to stick an electric heater in at any point.
I'm definitely going to give the adaptor a shot as others have said, worst case is I'm down £8, best case I save a lot of money.
Heaters are one of the things I was thinking about, also dust extraction running at the same time as a tool. I think on a ring it would be fine but most people don't seem to recommend them for new circuits, although I guess as with most things it's a case of "it depends" as to wether they'd recommend them or not.
I was thinking if I had 2 radials, I could run the tools on 1 of the circuits and the dust extraction, etc on the other so they can be used together
If you have an existing 13 amp plug socket with built in RCD protection rather than an RCD in the consumer unit you will need to replace the RCD socket and upgrade the consumer unit, because the sockets with built in RCD protection are only rated at 3 amps for inductive loads.
However with the machine costing over a thousand pounds with delivery skimping on connecting it to an electric supply seems inappropriate.
Looking at the specs there are 2 models. One has a 2.2kw motor and the other a 3kw motor. The 2.2kw version would run no-load at about 9.5 amps on 230v so should be ok on a 13a plug. the 3kw model runs at 13a no-load so may be pushing it.
The 3kw model has the 315mm blade. I'm looking at the 254mm blade, so 2.2kw
Should be ok then as long as you don't work it at maximum cut for long periods.
I have a Jet table saw - around 14 years old, supplied by Axminster. That was supplied with a chassis mount Schuko plug, with a trailing lead fitted with Schuko socket at one end, 13A UK at the other. I have used it for extended period and cutting some very hard resistant timbers and have never blown a fuse. It is 315mm but may only be around 2- 2.2 HP though.
When they say 16A plug, do they mean a Schuko/Euro type or the industrial type?
Maybe some people. Rings are perfectly acceptable for new circuits and many are put in every day.
Did I suggest that ? it elicited no response.
I don’t know the answer. All it says is “N.B. 16 Amp supply required, plug fitted.”
I’m not sure what the different types of plugs you mentioned are
I know, but thought I would ask again given my experience of buying a table saw from them. And we did get a response - albeit "unknown"
In the details it also says "UK plug fitted".
16 amp sockets are not actually acceptable in domestic electrical installations as they don’t have shutters.
Really you should hardwire the saw into a rotary switch supplied by a dedicated 16 amp circuit and if there are kids about the house lock the switch off with a padlock when the saw is not in use.
If you are going down the route of installing a 16 amp socket, you need to consider the garage as what it is a workshop, therefore it needs an electrical installation suitable for a workshop.
If I were installing a 16 amp socket in your garage I would be fitting an interlocking switched socket with a lock off facility like this on a dedicated circuit:
And noting on the installation certificate a non-compliance with BS7671 The Wiring Regulations 553.1.201 as it is not a shuttered socket.
You need to get a grip on reality that you are creating an industrial electrical installation in a domestic garage, so just installing a 16 amp socket technically contravenes the Wiring Regulations, so if you are going to do this the garage installation does need money spent on it to mitigate the potential risks.
Sorry, I must disagree.
Blue 16A plugs, sockets and 13A to 16A conveters are commonplace with people who have caravans, and I am not aware of any regulation which prevents their use.
If I go down the 16amp socket route then it will be done by a fully qualified electrician, so I will expect that socket to be fitted in a way that is compliant and safe. I won't be going anywhere near a CU or adding new circuits myself. I don't have young children, so I'm not too worried about that side of things, but if the electrician says it must be hardwired and that's the only way he is happy to do it, then I will go with their expertise so he can sign it off
I have just told you what the regulation is:
“And noting on the installation certificate a non-compliance with BS7671 The Wiring Regulations 553.1.201 as it is not a shuttered socket.”
The regulation states:
553.1.201 Every socket-outlet for household and similar use shall be of the shuttered type and, for an AC installation, shall preferably be of a type complying with BS 1363.
Domestic sockets don’t have to be 13 amp complying with BS 1363, but they shall be shuttered, therefore the blue 16 amp sockets cannot be used in domestic installations and comply with 553.1.201, using an interlocked switched socket reduces the risk, but is still a non-compliance with the Wiring Regulations.
I wouldn't think a workshop and/or garage would count as a "household or similar".
Yeah completely agree. If you use an interlocked socket as well so unable to energise without plug in.
Or as per my post No2, just fit a good quality 13A plug onto the saw, no issues with the install method then.
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