American style Siphonic toilets - in the UK?

Discussion in 'Plumbers' Talk' started by mlawson, Mar 17, 2019.

  1. mlawson

    mlawson New Member

    I am looking to replace the toilets in my house with American style replacements, I find that they are much cleaner than the ones usually found in UK/Europe - largely because of the use of siphonic flushing.

    However, it is virtually impossible to find them here.

    I am not adverse to buying from the US and shipping here, but before I do that I was wondering if anybody knew of somewhere that sells them? I need 2.

    Example is the American Standard 2876.016.020 Yorkville,
  2. Heat

    Heat Screwfix Select

    Double siphonic toilets are no longer made in U.K. I think.
    The advantages I don’t see as including being “cleaner”?
    Personally I would just install a good quality toilet sourced in U.K.
  3. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    How big are your poos?
    Joe the Plumber and Heat like this.
  4. mlawson

    mlawson New Member

    I was hoping to avoid the explanation, US toilets have a larger water surface area that means waste has less tendency to stick. So, it's either a US style toilet - or if anybody knows of any UK models with equivalent surface area then that would be ok. The siphonic construction of the flush means that there is more water in the bowl. I have not travelled widely within Europe so unsure if an equivalent exists closer to home.
    Heat likes this.
  5. mlawson

    mlawson New Member

    haha, the Americans take this seriously - they even have an online database
  6. Heat

    Heat Screwfix Select

    The British made double siphonic toilets were probably similar to what you describe.
    The first trap part is higher from floor than conventional pans and this is obvious by there being less of a fall to the water and bottom of trap.
    Also means higher water level is obviously at a wider part of the inner pan.
    Definitely the best toilets. Armitage used to make them. My toilet (over 40yr old) is one of them and would be a shame to replace it.
  7. MGW

    MGW Screwfix Select

    Our toilets did have a syphon years ago, however for it to work, you need a minimum amount of water to be flushed, and it was felt using a French type lift system allows less water to be used.

    Not sure that actually works as with the syphon system there was no chance of leakage, however the French system can result in a poorly fitting valve allowing a continues dribble of water down the pan, but seem to remember it is legally now not permitted to fit the old style. Maybe with brexit we will be allowed them again?
    mlawson likes this.
  8. Joe the Plumber

    Joe the Plumber Screwfix Select

    May I suggest your try an old Victorian style high level cistern loo. If you want 'umph' from your flush, you won't get better.

    All the 'dual syphonic' toilets I encounter these days have gone wrong and are a nightmare to repair. We've got two basic Lecico 'Atlas'
    close coupled loos (with lever cisterns, none of those awful buttons) in our house and never have problems with stuff left in the bowl.
    I'll admit I have slightly altered the syphons to give a full flush every time, which certainly helps.
  9. Muzungu

    Muzungu Screwfix Select

    Not to lower the tone but alot depends upon one's diet. Plenty of fibre and you don't get the sticks and smears, if you regularly get the "nine inchers" with the consistency of soft clay a bread knife comes in handy.
  10. The Teach

    The Teach Screwfix Select

    mlawson If you do import the American pans dont forget to get the transition outlet fixing flange suitable for uk. Plus a few spare wax gaskets :)

    For a decent wc the Ideal Standard aquablade range is Ok. There are so many wc's on the market but china does not have to come from china. Buying items made in the uk for the uk market has its advantages ;)
    mlawson, KIAB and WillyEckerslike like this.
  11. ecoplumbing

    ecoplumbing Active Member

    I'm pretty sure they've been discontinued in the uk because they no longer comply with building regs so I'm guessing it's import only. Might be worth considering parts as well though, if you do manage to find one, just make sure the toilet is compatible with uk parts, syphon, fill valve etc otherwise it's going to be a nightmare to work on
    mlawson likes this.
  12. WillyEckerslike

    WillyEckerslike Screwfix Select

    Don't you risk nicking your backside with the knife?
    goldenboy likes this.
  13. Muzungu

    Muzungu Screwfix Select

    Oh alright, scissors then.......actually on second thoughts.
    goldenboy and WillyEckerslike like this.
  14. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    Is that the same as having the snip? :)
  15. rogerk101

    rogerk101 Screwfix Select

    Having lived for many years in the USA, I am now very pleased no longer to have to put up with the incredible amount of water that American toilets waste.
    I have installed a few UK toilets since returning to the UK, and they're all now set to about 2.5 litres for a small flush and 5 litres for a big one. They all seem to get rid of everything in the first go.
    By contrast, an American style toilet would use well over double ... more like 3 or 4 times the amount ... of the big flush. Unless things have changed since I left there 10 years ago, dual flush toilets didn't even exist there - hence their expression "if it's yellow, leave it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down". In other words, they recognise the incredible waste of water so their solution to water savings is not to flush unless absolutely necessary.
  16. goldenboy

    goldenboy Super Member

    I think the all-you-can-eat diners in the US pay a terd tax to subsidise water usage and research and development for large scale human waste removal systems.

    Does the OP eat at Toby Carvery day in day out? Perhaps they might chip in?
  17. goldenboy

    goldenboy Super Member

    I tend to time it to leave my customers to deal with that hassle.
  18. mlawson

    mlawson New Member

    A US toilet must flush with less than 1.6 US gallons (6 litres) - and will flush first time with normally no residue to clean up with a brush. In contrast UK toilets seldom flush first time and normally require 2, sometimes 3 flushes to clean up fully. Thus it is actually using more water.
    Martin181 likes this.
  19. goldenboy

    goldenboy Super Member

    If you are requiring three flushes everytime i think the issue may be user error. 15529070572197456298529779696284.png
  20. mlawson

    mlawson New Member

    That would explain it, and don't get me started on those Dyson urinals!
    chippie244 and goldenboy like this.

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