Discussion in 'Just Talk' started by Isitreally, Nov 5, 2018.
Brexit. What the nation really think.
I watched some of it.
What was the end result?
No idea. I changed to channel 5 to watch Police Interceptors.
It was more interesting.
I suppose we can watch the ch4 ‘What the Nation Really Thinks’ on catch up.
In what way, there were various questions.
I am guessing Chippie meant - what was the general conclusion of the programme.
I am guessing it leaned towards the Remain side by poll results but was countered by various arguments.
I started to watch it - but it became too depressing after around 25 seconds.
I only saw the end with my leaver MiL when the poll said remain.
Lol. You were tactful I hope...?
My own in-laws voted Remain, but only after my wife and her sister persuaded them the vote wasn't about 'their' Britain, and not even about 'ours'; it was about the children, their grand-kids.
What's funny now is that MiL sneers and pffffts at all the Leaver loons and the daily bad Brexit news as tho' she'd always been a hardened Remainer...
Anyhoo, I saw the Ch4 result this morn - it's mildly reassuring, but the damage has been done whatever now happens. What a hellishly polarised and bigoted country we now have, as it is in America. Great Britain's dignity lies in tatters; no more are we the bastion of reason and common sense.
Perhaps it needed this for us to realise we are just another small country? Could be cathartic.
Did you see the analysis of how the result came to being. ???
If you had you wouldn't be as smug.
Its not so much people have changed their minds, its down to a vast number of those surveyed didn't vote the 1st time round, they tipped the balance, most of them being younger.
Don't be fooled into not thinking the whole program was steered towards the remain side.
I didn't watch it, IIR - you clearly have.
'Smug'? Really? "it's mildly reassuring, but the damage has been done whatever now happens..." is 'smug'?
But, you do inadvertently raise an important issue; at what point does the change in voting demographic really make the Leave decision completely undemocratic? Voting intention has already changed and we haven't even left yet.
Continued like this, another couple of years would very likely see a further 6+% change as more bigots die off and those who will be most directly affected come to voting age. What about another 2 years after that? What about 10 years - after the damage has been caused and those who voted for it will be keeping that sorry fact close to their chests?
We may have save them youngsters from the inevitable crash of the EU and all the fall out that come with it.
As you say we are leaving no matter what, so its about time you remainers stop trying to upset the apple cart and get together to make the best for this country and not consistently bring it down.
Careful lads - Nostradamus is here!
As I remember, only Filly boy had the stones to quantify what he meant by a European collapse.
How about you IIR? Prepared to make a quantitative prediction? "Crash" means what? "Inevitable" means when?
The reality is the separation we currently have in the UK over the Brexit issue is mainly due to the Remainers stance.
On the thought of young first time voters predicted to vote Remain, - Wouldn’t that be relying on votes from a section of largely naive people who tend to be more left wing and selfish at that age?
Those in work tended to vote remain.
We had economic policy decided by the economically inactive (the retired and the unemployed).
Although I agree that wanting a healthy economy when you're employed is somewhat selfish.
Wasn't it you, Heat, you completely turned around my opinion on lowering the voting age - for which I gave and give you continued thanks?
My original take was that I understood that many - most - youngsters are almost instinctively idealistic and altruistic and tended towards left-wing (and less selfish) ideologies, so I thought that it would be an unfair distortion on election results even tho' it would largely back up my own feelings. You - quite rightly - pointed out that this left-leaning distortion would be no worse than the elderlys' almost identical right-leaning impulse, and that the yoof would certainly be no less informed.
Ergo it would balance out the extremes.
I agree, so I thank you again for completely changing my mind on this. Franchise for toddlers!
I think that's the point.
The SNP tried that in Scotland, getting 16 and 17 year olds to be allowed to vote in the independence referendum on the assumption that they were young, naïve, idealistic and thus more likely to support separation. Backfired, though, da yoof had a majority against independence.
There's this idiotic idea that because more young people have come to voting age since 2016 and since old codgers have died off there will be a natural swing to remain. Supporters of this idea forget that as people age so they acquire responsibilities - spouses, children, mortgages, careers - and so tend to become naturally more small-c conservative.
If you look at the EU Ref voting demographic based on age, then there will be - is already - a swing towards Remain simply due to older voters shuffling off this mortal coil. Based on this alone, it has been calculated that the 17th Jan 2019 (I may be a few days out...) will tip the result towards Remain.
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