Bathroom waste bodge help!

Discussion in 'Plumbers' Talk' started by DIYthenseekhelp, Aug 21, 2020.

  1. DIYthenseekhelp

    DIYthenseekhelp New Member

    Hi all,

    I started like most with the intention of doing a small DIY job and replace the bath. Not a biggy I think, I’ve managed before!

    Until I realise what’s hidden under there from the previous owner!

    Now I’m not sure what to do... It could be something very simple that I’m missing or a big job. Hence the shout for help!

    So the bathroom waste is connected to the soil pipe somewhat awkwardly, the pipe enters the bathroom at floorboard level and off centre of the bath. This then meets a 50mm welded tees off to the bath and sink.

    There is a 50mm to 40mm internal reducer in the tees and this is then connected to two elbows/couplers and was originally then also connected to a shallow appliance trap instead of a bath trap!

    Due to height of the previous bath and the level of the waste, the previous attempt also included cutting out the subfloor (where there just happened to be pipework and a joist!)

    The new bath waste is slightly further back and whilst not clear in the picture, is a couple of inches to the left of the existing waste pipes. All the pipes are solvent welded.

    There is nothing to cut where I can add in new pipe for the bath and shy of having to pull ALL of the waste pipework out back to the soil, I’m unsure what to do here!

    I’ve added a pic. Any help much appreciated!
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Aug 21, 2020
  2. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    Just a quick thought from me ......

    Either look at a flexi 40mm connector which simplifies install when pipes don't line up - several types available, this is an example, Mcalpine great quality though so bare in mind

    https://www.screwfix.com/p/mcalpine-flexcon2-flexible-connector-white-40-x-460mm/43713

    Or by using solvent weld 135 degree bends and short section of pipe, you can usually get pipe to where you need it. May not be the prettiest pipework but its outta sight so ........

    https://www.screwfix.com/p/floplast-bends-135-white-40mm-5-pack/35521
     
  3. DIYthenseekhelp

    DIYthenseekhelp New Member


    Thanks Dave,

    I was considering the flexi connector but the position of the trap vs the existing elbow means that it would create a sort of second trap or U bend with the pipe, if you get my meaning. Would something like this provide less ‘slack‘ in the pipe? https://www.screwfix.com/p/mcalpine-flexicon4-flexible-connector-white-40-x-157-242mm/86386

    Is there anything else I might need to be wary of here? Trap sitting lower than waste etc?

    Cheers :)
     
  4. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select


    Once the waste pipe enters the wall, whats the route and access like up to the soil stack ?
    Would it be better, although more work agreed to pull the lot out and re-pipe, including connection for basin

    The flexi in your link is indeed shorter and has a compression connection on both ends, as I said, several types available and although the 'pros' don't like using or recommending them, as long as you have access under the bath when needed, what can go wrong !

    Best in practice to have as few bends as possible in pipe run and most direct route but its your place, again, future access is a must for potential blockages and just depends on how much destruction your prepared to take on

    If you go with a flexi connection, just make sure its supported along its length with say timber off-cuts, otherwise it will sag and become a second trap, likely to encourage a build up of 'crud' and other such nasties

    Hard to tell from pictures the misalignment but again, 135 degree bends are useful for subtle direction changes. Always have a dry run before welding together

    As for level of trap, look at any sink in your house and you will see the trap sits lower than waste pipe - P Trap or Bottle Trap

    Bath trap, plenty of shallow ones available as common problem with depth under bath to floorboards;

    https://www.screwfix.com/p/mcalpine-bath-trap-white-40mm/84362

    If you do go with the flexi connection, ensure its supported along its length with say timber off-cuts. Otherwise it will sag, form a 2nd trap and likely encourage the build up of 'crud' and other nasties
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2020
  5. DIYthenseekhelp

    DIYthenseekhelp New Member

    Instead of having separate wastes for the light water and the bath, everything has been run into that single 50mm and out into the stack. I’ve attached a picture of the stack outside.

    I got a shallow trap and tried a flexible connector but it just wouldn’t work. Even when I could manage to squeeze it in, it wasn’t good and ended up looking like something from a water park and there’s too much tension (see dry run picture). The leftover waste seems to be at just the wrong angle.

    Tried with an elbow and again, just wrong angle and I can’t raise the bath any. (See pic)

    I even considered putting the trap on backwards! :eek: but it wouldn’t work anyway.

    I’m at a loss as to what else I can do other than take it all back to the stack :(
     

    Attached Files:

  6. 2dowhat

    2dowhat Member

    I've found the Wirquin solvent weld flex connectors are more suitable when space is limited due to them being shorter in length.
     
  7. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select


    So,,,,, what route does the waste pipe from bathroom take once it enters wall, shown in your 2nd picture (1st post)
    Is that bathroom wall the outside wall ?

    Exactly how much effort will it be to replace the lot back to the stack ?

    You know the route and access issues ,,,, we don't :)

    Nothing wrong with running the basin and bath out via the same pipe - at least 50mm pipe has been correctly used in this case

    Would be good to avoid the water park 'flume ride' set up that you mention and re-pipe all nice and neat and tidy

    Some inspiration for you ..... perhaps ?

     
    Sunny Blackpool and 2dowhat like this.
  8. DIYthenseekhelp

    DIYthenseekhelp New Member

    Haha, a fair point. Rip it out and start again is often the best way.

    Sorry, yes in the photo, that is the back wall. The white 50mm reducer you can see in the pic linked is sat inside the tees that also leads to the basin and straight outside to the elbow you see on the stack.

    Replacing it all will have to include the basin run and the stack section and of course the boxing in (hate that :confused:. I was worried as to whether that last fitting into the stack is push fit as otherwise will the also mean a new boss/section?
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2020
  9. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    That soil stack is all push fit, including the 50mm waste connection to boss section so easy peasy

    Only the waste pipe from basin and bath is solvent weld so scrap it and start again - as Edward Collins mentions :)

    Nothing wrong with keeping the basin waste set up - ie, run it into bath waste using 50mm pipe. Should be minor disturbance to basin pipe work ? Just cut and join under bath (although easier for you to tell if possible)

    There are videos on YouTube of people removing solvent weld fittings with everything from hot air gun to lighter fuel and everything in-between

    Can’t say myself how successful this may or may not be, sounds risky to me and high potential for future leaks so only you can decide

    As that wall under bath is the outside wall, doesn’t look a terrible amount of extra work to rip out and re-pipe, get it all nice and tidy and running correctly, only a few quid in extra pipe and fittings

    You know you’ve done a nice job that way and not a lash up that’s a ‘make do’ and hide it under bath panel :eek:
     
  10. terrymac

    terrymac Screwfix Select

    You need a different trap ,the one you have us too shallow for connection to
    a soil stack. You need a trap with a deeper water seal ,and more alignment adjustability. Code 40633 Screwfix is one such Mcalpine trap.
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2020
  11. DIYthenseekhelp

    DIYthenseekhelp New Member

    Thanks guys. I have bought a deeper trap and will get up the ladder and make sure it’s push fit and I’ll do a new run!
     
  12. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    It is push fit
    As is that complete boss section and stack
    And the toilet pipe

    Depends if O ring is ok to re-use or perished and cracked, may need some lube to fit new pipe

    It’s gonna be a much better job in the end :)
     
    DIYthenseekhelp likes this.

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