belly in wall?

Discussion in 'Builders' Talk' started by legepe, Jul 10, 2019.

  1. legepe

    legepe Member

    Hi all,
    This is a building with GF and two upper floors. The building at a guess is around 1850 build and was originally a bakehouse with ovens on the side of it - The wall is bellying out around 3" at around one meter from ground level, there was a chimney stack which has been removed from GF upto 1st floor (which is unsupported - see last pic)
    Cant see brickwork/plaster inside because all walls on all floors are covered with plywood paneling (being there a long time)
    Externally there are no signs of cracking, just more like badly weathered mortar joins (mainly going up the wall where the chimney is. And to the untrained eye it doesnt look like there are any signs of subsidence.
    There has been at some point a "stay" put through the wall to the other side of building however, I am confused how this is working as im guessing it must go all the way through to the other side (which is not accessible) and it would have to go all the way through the solid wall????
    Looking at pictures does anyone think that this could be something serious to rectify or is it simply a matter of repointing, etc...
    Any advice very welcom
    Thanks
    legepe
     

    Attached Files:

  2. sospan

    sospan Well-Known Member

    Whilst it is difficult to say from those pictures, can't see anything majorly wrong with the building
     
  3. legepe

    legepe Member

    Its difficult to see in the pictures but the belly in the wall is out between 3 to 4 inch, just didnt know if it was sufficent to cause a major problem or not.. thanks for reply though...
     
  4. dobbie

    dobbie Well-Known Member

    Are you sure it is a solid wall?,there does not look to be any brick bond for a 9" wall ie Flemish or English.
     
  5. legepe

    legepe Member

    Im not a builder so not really understanding brick bond or Flemish English? In my ignorance I simply assumed it to be a 9" wall but your probably right there and there must be some type of cavity...
     
  6. legepe

    legepe Member

    This has got me thinking more... Is it at all possible that its a single skin gable end wall???
     
  7. sospan

    sospan Well-Known Member

    No its definitly at least a double skin, you can tell by the brick patterns
     
  8. legepe

    legepe Member

    Thanks a lot sospan... I panicked a little thinking that could it possibly be only single skin.. but yes I can see the bricks tied in around every five coarse.. still dont understand what dobbie ment with brick bond and flemish english? Can anyone explain that?
     
  9. sospan

    sospan Well-Known Member


    have a look at this https://www.forterra.co.uk/resources/design-advice/brickwork-details/brick-bond-patterns

    What you have is a fairly random bond with bricks laid at 90 degrees every so often. You quite often see that in older industrial buildings where the walls are very thick with no cavity. If you look at the wall the vertical lines between the bricks don't line up as well. Quite often this is because the wall was made with a mixture of brick sizes

    upload_2019-7-10_22-44-12.png
     
  10. dobbie

    dobbie Well-Known Member

    Flemish bond is a header then a stretcher then a header then a stretcher which ties the wall together.
    English bond is a row of headers which can be every other course.
    Your wall seems to have very few headers tieing it together.
    http://theheritagedirectory.co.uk/uploads/articles/Brick Bonds v2.pdf
     
  11. Joe the Plumber

    Joe the Plumber Active Member

    Whatever you end up doing (and it looks okay to me from the pictures, but then I'm only a plumber...), please remember that any re-pointing MUST be done using lime mortar, NOT cement based mortar. The building will have been built using lime mortar.

    You can get lime mortar from here (I've used them for it myself):

    https://www.lime-mortars.co.uk/

    If you use cement based mortar (ie what every modern house is built from), any water absorbed by the bricks in freezing weather will expand and blow the faces off them. Lime mortar is a sacrificial substance and that erodes instead of the bricks, as shown on your wall.

    So many old buildings are being ruined by idiots who don't know what they're doing when it comes to re-pointing (including the front wall of my 1900s house, courtesy of the previous owners....)
     
  12. koolpc

    koolpc Well-Known Member

    That vertical crack doesn't look good.

    Structural Engineer would be my port of call
     
  13. HappyHacker

    HappyHacker Active Member

    I agree with koolpc. Get a structural engineer in. It is difficult to see from the photos what is going on and we are only guessing at what may be the problem and its severity.
     

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