Can I temporarily insulate a conservatory roof?

Discussion in 'Builders' Talk' started by tonynoarm, Nov 12, 2006.

  1. Wendy1970

    Wendy1970 New Member

    We completed our roof a few months ago and although all went well could I ask anyone who's done it using upvc cladding what they used for the joins as we have tried loads of things but after time they fall off we believe it's to do with the heat softening the adhesive. We have tried using silicone, double sided tape superglue but all have eventually come off.
  2. Devil's Advocate

    Devil's Advocate Well-Known Member

    Hi Wendy.

    What gap are you trying to cover? Have you tried the self-adhesive beading you get for the backs of worktops and baths? A rolled up plastic strip with a fold along its middle, and self-sticking.

    If that doesn't work, I think this will:

    (I should have shares...)
  3. Wendy1970

    Wendy1970 New Member

    Thanks devils advocate. Trying to cover the 3 joins that's are along the front and at top where the corners are, pic attached. Yeah we tried the bath sealant on a roll and was perfect as as you say folds in the middle. Held up for a few weeks then started to come off. So tried sticking it back up with all kinds of glue. Was thinking that it was the heat that was softening the glue making it fall off.

    Attached Files:

  4. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Who didn't work it out so the joints would be inline.:rolleyes:
  5. Wendy1970

    Wendy1970 New Member

    Yeah we couldn't remedy that. We tried all ways buts gave up. It's still been so much better in the warm weather we can actually sit in there without getting over heated. Just gotta wait until winter to see how well it keeps the heat in.
  6. Devil's Advocate

    Devil's Advocate Well-Known Member

    So you still have all these strips ready cut to size and mitred? Cool - re-use them, with thin beads of that Stixall either side of the self-adhesive bands.

    Seriously, that stuff is very impressive - and very heat resistant. Stick the strips back up, and wipe along the edges with a cloth to remove any excess that's been squeezed out.

    Job's a jobbie.

    Most likely...
  7. impsince85

    impsince85 Member

    Hi all

    I've been following this thread since October last year and really appreciate all the advice and info that's been given. I'm a single mum of 2 so juggling work and the boys I haven't had any free time to make a start on my conservatory until this week as I'm off work - although I can't do too much as it's summer holidays and the boys don't want to be stuck in with me doing DIY!

    The reason I first started looking into it is I want to turn it into a playroom for the boys as my house currently resembles a toy shop! o_O

    Anyway I'm a complete DIY novice but I've so far put up all the thermal blinds. Whilst doing this I tested the roof to see if I can drill through the current aluminium strips, I know I need to drill 3mm pilot holes. I'd say 3mm was about as deep as the drill will this normal or is it just me being weak? I obviously don't want the screw going all the way through but if the drill gets stuck at 3mm are the screws going to get stuck at this point too when I try and attach the battens?

    It's a standard conservatory approx 8ft x 13ft with a roof sloping down away from the house towards the garden. With 2 aluminium rails running vertically down the slope. Here are some pics - I know these aluminium rails aren't the thickest depth wise but I'm now wondering whether I will have to lower this new roof (I'm battening, multi foil insulation and pvc cladding by the way) which I don't really want to do as I'll be even more out of my depth in doing that! Any advice will be greatly received!! :)

    Attached Files:

  8. Devil's Advocate

    Devil's Advocate Well-Known Member

    Hello Imp.

    I think, almost certainly, you are only drilling into the white PVC layer on these aluminium 'rafters' - your drill 'stops' when you hit the actual aluminium that you still need to drill in to. As you suspect, the screws won't hold in the PVC layer - they do need to bite into the aluminium.

    These ali rails are hollow, so the idea is to get the screw to end inside that central void. That should be easy enough - when your drill passes through the ali into the middle space, you should feel it 'burst through'. That's when you stop...

    Are your drills in good condition? (If not, our hosts - is there a branch near you? - are selling Erbauer drill sets at a decent price at the mo'.)

    3mm would normally be a fair size to go for, but it depends on the screw size you will be using - the hole has to be still small enough for the screw thread to 'bite' into and be secure. That will take a bit of effort - if the screw goes in too easily, then the hole was too large for it!

    What you should feel when you drill is; very easy as you go through the PVC layer followed by tougher going (tho' still 'easy' if your drill bits are good) into the aluminium, followed by the drill dropping into the empty central void of the rafter. Stop there!

    The swarf that comes away will be white (PVC) followed by silver (ali).
  9. Sean_ork

    Sean_ork Screwfix Select

    that's a very good point :rolleyes:
  10. Devil's Advocate

    Devil's Advocate Well-Known Member

    Yep, but I'm banking on it being quilted insulation and lightweight PVC cladding.
  11. Biochef

    Biochef Member

    Why not use self drilling screws straight through wood into aluminium frame I think it would be almost impossible to pre drill holes then try and match up with wooden frame screwfix sell all types of self drilling screws specially adapted for your needs
  12. impsince85

    impsince85 Member

    Thank you for your swift reply!

    My drill is nearly new and Bosch make with Bosch drill bits...this should be sufficient I'm guessing? So it sounds like it's me being weak! It is tougher drilling upwards!

    Fingers crossed this photo works showing my test holes and where they stop, it has begun to go into the aluminium I think and not just the pvc, ignore the dirtiness please!

    Also I was wondering which timber I should go for as most seems to be very heavy that I've come across so far, I was hoping for the very lightweight timber like the sort that is used to make rabbit runs to put as little weight on the roof as possible.

    Attached Files:

  13. Devil's Advocate

    Devil's Advocate Well-Known Member

    Good point, Bio. But I think that approach does require a certain amount of understanding of that type of screw, and it being kept very straight, good pressure, etc.

    I think the thing to do is to hold up the timber batten, drill right through to leave a mark, drill through the ali on this mark and then fit the first screw, holding the other end of the batten up using tape or similar. Then drill through the others.
  14. Devil's Advocate

    Devil's Advocate Well-Known Member

    Hi Imp.

    Ok, that is ali you are drilling through, and you simply haven't gone through yet.

    HOWEVER, please wait for advice on where on that rail to drill - the hole near the edge looks as though it might go through into the Poly roofing... :eek:

    I also notice that along the centre line of the rail is a narrow 'groove' - I wonder if this suggests there is a 'web' inside the hollow section at that point? In which case, you don't want to drill there EITHER!!!

    But, once we do manage to tell you where to drill :)rolleyes:), you can use light timber - I would suggest treated (tanalised) roofing battens which are rough-sawn 2x1.

    Anyways, please wait for someone who knows to make recommendations on where on that ali rail to drill.

    And, yes, that is aluminium you are drilling in to. The white layer is just a thin coating - probably powder-coated, so only micro-thin.
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2014
  15. Devil's Advocate

    Devil's Advocate Well-Known Member

    Imp, is there any chance you could take a photo from the outside of your connie aimed at the END of one of these ali rails? If there is a cap over them, could you prise that off first?
  16. impsince85

    impsince85 Member

    Hello again,

    Ok thanks for the thumbs up... However before I read that message I persisted with the hole in the middle (as I remember gedevan saying to drill in the middle) and it went through into the middle empty space you told me about earlier. Do you still need a photo? There's no daylight shining through the hole so I assume rightly or wrongly that all is ok? (Fingers and toes crossed!):D
  17. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Looking at your pics, I'm thinking that those rails are just alloy H sections and you haven't got a void to drill into, you will just be drilling through the lower section into the area the plastic sheets sits in, this isn't the ideal thing to do.
  18. Devil's Advocate

    Devil's Advocate Well-Known Member

    Hi Imp.

    Tee-hee - women! Give them a drill, and stand well back... :rolleyes:. ( :) )

    Ok, there are two scenarios here as far as I can make out; the first is that the aluminium rails you have are a 'basic' 'H' profile as Phil suggests. Imagine that 'H' turned on its side with a sheet of poly roofing slotted in to each 'U' part?

    If it's this type of rail then in the centre you have a solid 'I' (the centre part of that 'H'), so you cannot successfully drill up into that.

    The other scenario is that you have a somewhat better rail system which is more like 2 'H' turned on their sides and then pushed together so that you have the slot at each side for the poly roof but also have a separate 'void' in the middle.

    With this type, it shouldn't be a problem to drill into that central void - it doesn't affect the poly roof sheets. With the first type, it could be a problem.

    That's why we need to find out what you have.

    You say you've drilled through this rail in the centre and it 'felt' as tho' the drill popped into an empty space? Ok, that's promising, but could it be that the drill went in sideways so ended up to the side of that central 'I'? Ie - is that hole you've drilled right bang in the middle and going dead straight upwards?
  19. Sean_ork

    Sean_ork Screwfix Select

    this thread makes me groan - am sure someone will soon ask how can they temporarily insulate a tent - another structure not designed to have all manner of timber and cladding added to it

    this most recent one is probably the most flimsy of them all - if you really are determined to insulate the roof ponder doing it externally - 18mm OSB, 100mm poly, another 18mm OSB - EPDM roof - perhaps with a frame below so that all of the weight bears down on the entire structure (including the uprights) - rather than pulling down on those really lightweight glazing sections

    none of these projects look at all temporary to me

    if you do use a multifoil - use a proper one (and they really aren't cheap) - if you use a cheap multifoil, you won't notice any thermal improvement

    and buy a hard hat
  20. impsince85

    impsince85 Member

    I fear you may be right and it's slightly gone to the side DA. I need to borrow some ladders to get high up enough to take the photo to upload, I'll be back on to update as soon as that's done thank you.

    Sean_ork please can you explain the outer roof in English please? :oops:

    I'm a woman and a novice but I'm trying! It's sounding like I may need to lower the roof... And mine will be very much a permanent measure not temporary as the thread suggests.

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