Chelsea Manning

Discussion in 'Just Talk' started by Harry Stottle, Jan 19, 2017.

  1. Certain guns are illegal to buy in the uk, but they are still available if you know where to go. You don't get them from a shop.

    That cheese is exactly the same.

    Foie gras is illegal in uk, because of animal welfare laws, not eu laws.

    Now, is that misinformation by mistake?

    Or a deliberate lie ?

    See the problem ?
  2. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Certain guns??? I don't get your point on that one.

    Cheese, yes banned but still being produced.

    Foie gras isn't illegal in the UK, just certain practices of producing it are banned by the EU.

    I'm not sure of the point of your post, it look to point out you can buy banned stuff, well the was my point, its still being produced even though its banned in the EU.

    As in Veal which was what started it.

  3. Guns was just an easy analogy.

    That you missed its point is unfortunate, but not unexpected.

    The cheese is not on sale in europe, though I am sure its available under the counter.

    Foie gras is illegal to produce in uk, but not europe, but can be sold here.

    Absinthe is not banned.

    The anti europe sites you are using for your information, or your interpretation of them is wrong.

    Much like your info about Germany.

    The big question is, is it deliberate or not ?
  4. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    It was a choice of stay or leave.
    Stay = well, stay as we are, don't change anything.
    Leave = well, leave, get out of the eu and everything that's baggaged with it.

    Would you have been tempted to vote for a soft brexit, if it was a choice on the paper?

    Not that it makes any difference, not a 'jot',
    Because it wasn't an option, leave or stay, that was the question.
    I voted to leave in the full understanding that it meant just that.
    And 'leave' was the box that had the most marks, after the count.

    Accept it!
  5. Longs, if you are trying to suggest that a goodly - majority? - proportion of the Leavers gave it a thought beyond "Bludy immigrants" or "Bludy human rights!" or "Bludy bananas" or "Bludy Germans telling us what to do" or "Third Reich" or anything similar to that, you can try. But you'll come across as silly and dishonest.

    You know damn well it was simplistic at best. It was driven by Faragisms. And other lies. And fearmongering.

    The evidence is in the media, is on this thread (nuts, anyone?) and in every conversation I've had with 'real' folk in the 'real' world.

    It is head-bangingly awful, the lack of thought.

    What's more, some of us on here warned of the consequences - the swing to the far right. How did we know? 'Cos it was as obvious as an obvious thing.

    Belive me, the economy is the least of the Brexit issue.

    And, NO - we WON'T accept it.

    And you will find out in the not too distant future that we don't even have to - 'cos it's going to be watered down to be Brexit in name only. Because, ultimately, we aren't that stupid.

    Bludy EU - helped turn us from the Sick Man of Europe to the 5th largest economy. Damn them! Whilst helping to keep us safe. And protected as human beings. DAMN THEM TO HELL!

    Anyhoo, are you lovin' the UK's new friends?
  6. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    In HA's case it was leave so a packet of peanuts didn't have to say "May contain nuts"
    Deleted member 164349 likes this.
  7. wiggy

    wiggy Screwfix Select

    Brexit is going to be a tea party by comparsion to what trump is going to do.

    And what's all this WE dev? Anyone would think you are getting a seat at the table.
  8. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    Those (the majority), who voted to leave did so with the expectation that a 'leave' vote, would be just that.
    We would leave the European Union and everything that comes with it.

    I'm sure that a vast number of leavers voted for the simplistic reasons that you've stated above.
    And I'm sure that you'd agree, that a vast number of remain voters did so based on nothing more than the fear of losing their jobs, benefit cuts, economic meltdown and starvation, that had been promised as a consequence of a leave vote?

    As a logical individual, you surely agree?

    Whether or not you say so, is a different matter!
  9. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    If we hadn't been given a referendum, Trump wouldn't be president.
    It's our fault, DA, will tell ya.
    Deleted member 33931 and wiggy like this.
  10. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Was reading earlier some Americans are saying, "Trump done more in a week, than Obama in 8 years".
  11. btiw

    btiw Well-Known Member

    I agree Phil; their grammar is appalling.
    Deleted member 33931 likes this.
  12. btiw

    btiw Well-Known Member

    It's not really possible to say why millions of individuals voted the was that they did.

    However, the "leave" options weren't specified. No alternative was ever offered or voted upon. The government is trying to guess what precisely that "no" meant.

    I've said before that if a logical and economically rational leave argument was offered then I could have been persuaded to vote leave. But one wasn't offered. The argument never got much beyond "there are lots of foreigners". That argument didn't work for me as I'm planning on getting older. I was quite looking forward to those foreigners keeping the economy going (native U.K. demographic show a population bust in our 20-35 age group).

    "No" just meant that people created their own utopian fantasy with no plan of how it could be achieved.

    Our economy is reasonably resilient. The fundamentals haven't changed. Change will result in winners and losers. The problem will be that losers will shout louder than winners.

    ...but whatever... leave won. Well played sirs. But they didn't win an exemption from me saying "I told you so" every time inflation goes up, or the pound goes down, or every time the BoE drops hundred of billions of QE to deal with market fears.
  13. Harry Stottle

    Harry Stottle Screwfix Select

    The problem that Remainers have is that they put up no sensible arguments for staying in the EU, all I heard from the remain side of the discussions pre referendum were fantasies about doom and gloom; tales of families being thousands of pounds worse off, invasion by the Russians, millions of jobs lost, collapse of the economy etc., etc. Cameron and Osborne had to rope in Obama to give us the "back of queue" lecture yet still the British people had the good sense to vote to get out.
    What I find odd is how some still believe that we'd be better off inside the EU with all its corruption, stupid regulations, daft carbon targets, silly agricultural bureaucracy, unfair fishing rules, lax borders, EU courts that are helping terrorists to enjoy our benefits whilst they plan to bomb us.
    Come on Remainers - see sense.
  14. Harry Stottle

    Harry Stottle Screwfix Select

    Hey btiw, What's that about foreigners keeping the economy growing and helping you in your old age? Carry on dreaming, it wouldn't work like that. What would happen is that the benefits bill would rocket and the next generation would have to support an even bigger population of old folks.
  15. btiw

    btiw Well-Known Member

    Get data or get out.

    I'm happy to debate this with hard numerical facts, I just want to know that you'll be bringing some too. Or is this just going to be assertions?
    Deleted member 164349 likes this.
  16. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Followed by

    Just saying. :D:D:D:D:D

  17. I do agree the remain arguments were poor, but based on logical thinking. Doom and gloom, inflation, jobs, economy. Russia hovering on the edges. Lets see what transpires shall we ?

    But the exit vote was nothing more than immigrants (european) and money for the nhs. I never saw a single positive argument for our future. Remember johnson, specifically, saying a "few" will be hurt by loss of jobs etc as we change.

    Who needs to see sense I ask ?
    Deleted member 33931 likes this.
  18. btiw

    btiw Well-Known Member

    It's a fair cop.
  19. "No" just meant that people created their own utopian fantasy with no plan of how it could be achieved.

    That is the most accurate comment made by anybody on any side. Government included
  20. We = fellow Remoaners :)
    wiggy likes this.

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice