Coroner urges Goverment to review Halogen bulb safety

Discussion in 'Electricians' Talk' started by JC2779, Apr 16, 2019.

  1. JC2779

    JC2779 Member

    An unbelievably horrific accident.. I know they had an alarm fitted in this case but I've lost track of the amount of alarms that have been removed / disconnected and plugs where people haven't removed that paper cover before plugging the item in.. even people putting 100w lamps in shades because 60w wasn't bright enough, to the point the shades are starting to discolour and warp from the heat.

    6 year old dies from a fire caused by a halogen bulb
     
  2. xray19

    xray19 New Member

    very sad thanks for the heads up
     
  3. John Murphy

    John Murphy New Member

    I’m sure that an EU Directive is that halogen bulbs have been banned so they will gradually disappear off the shelves and LED’s will be taking the place. Unfortunately it’s a tragic accident.
     
  4. Sparkielev

    Sparkielev Well-Known Member

    Am surprised this hasn't happened more often the sooner these are off the market the better, such a tragic accident
     
  5. xray19

    xray19 New Member

    i have some in the garage i've kept but they are now going in the bin again thanks
     
  6. Pollowick

    Pollowick Well-Known Member

    An unfortunate accident and is probably not the first.

    One problem with banning "halogens" is that is some cases there are no suitable LED replacements. I have several linear halogens:
    R7s -118mm and the nearest LED replacement is 25mm diameter and only 60% of output;
    78mm ones, again 25mm diameter which may not fit although they have the light output but are non-dimmable (at present);
    G9 - 40w where teh replacements are not quite bright enough and I may have difficulty installing;
    G9 48w ECO - nothing at te right brightness yet;
    G4 20w - the fittings are very small and there may now be some that could fit, although they may still be slightly dimmer

    All of mine are in fixed locations where they were designed for - wall, ceiling, under cabinet and just one G4 in a "designer" desk lamp. All will be replaced when there are good LEDs available, and this demonstrates teh problems users face at present,
     
  7. KIAB

    KIAB Well-Known Member

    Very tragic incident,sadly unlikely to be the last.

    G9 lamps, Osram Parathom 3.8W LED G9 are suppose to be good,going to order one for a desk lamp , & another G4 one for another desk lamp here to try

    https://www.ledvance.com/products/l...fit-pin-base-g9/parathom-led-pin-g9/index.jsp

    https://www.osram.com/ds/ecat/PARAT...01_1032189/PP_EUROPE_Europe_eCat/ZMP_2925901/

    Already fit a T26 Osram Parathon Special LED lamp to fridge.

    https://www.ledvance.com/products/lamps/led-lamps/professional-special-led-lamps/index.jsp


     
  8. Pollowick

    Pollowick Well-Known Member

    The G4 claims a 1.8W LED equates to 20W with a 200 Lm output which is at the top end of LEDs. However a 20W Haologen can give 300 Lm or greater.

    Similarly, I have some cheap G9 Halogens 42W and 625 Lm. The G9 linked to claims 40w equivalent and just 470 Lm.
     
  9. KIAB

    KIAB Well-Known Member

    Will have to dig out my light meter & compare things,got some GU10 LED lamps & the lumens were better than what they claimed on the box.
     
  10. Pollowick

    Pollowick Well-Known Member

    Looking at those specs that also give an "end of life" rating of 0.7 ... which is a significant degradation. I wonder where the claim output figure is taken from? New, 100 hours, 1000 hours, half life, end-of-life?
     
  11. MGW

    MGW Well-Known Member

    Think there are a number is issues with quartz bulbs.
    1) G9 and like there needs to be a glass globe to stop UV light and catch the bits should one shatter, however because LED and quartz bulbs fit the same holder you can get lamps which don't have the glass globe as designed for use with LED.
    2) With the old BA22d or E27 bulb replacement the quartz envelope is inside a glass envelope, which is OK with a ceiling lamp, if it is however fitted in a standard or table lamp, if knocked over with an old tungsten light bulb when the glass smashes the filament ruptures so light goes out and very little chance of fire, however with the quartz bulb when the outer glass smashes the bulb does not extinguish but the 250°C quartz ends up in contact with shade or other items and will set them on fire.
    3) The mass of quartz is much greater than the mass of glass or tungsten so even if the light goes out when knocked over, it takes longer to cool.

    With MR16 be it GU10 or GU5.3 the lights were designed for quartz bulbs from start, we have three different holders, GZ10 allows bulbs where heat can past through the reflector, GU10 where heat is also reflected, and GU10 L2 where only LED versions can be fitted, it does seem not like that with GU5.3 assume all holders can work with dichroic bulbs, but with BA22d I have had double adaptors so I can use bulb and iron at same time, and the brass fitting is often earthed where the plastic one is not yet I have yet to find a LED bulb marked as Class II. With the E27 there is no option to earth the bulb so clearly all are Class II, but ES in USA is 28 mm not 27 mm so we have a problem ensuring correct holder for European bulbs, so any grey import could result in bulb falling out, and even if it does have a glass envelope that will smash so hot quartz ends up on carpet.

    However I thought the quartz bulb is now no longer supplied, can sell off old stock but not buy new, so what is the point in asking Government to ban what has already been banned?
     
    KIAB likes this.
  12. Comlec

    Comlec Well-Known Member

    Indeed a tragic accident but many more fires are caused by naked flames. There is no call to restrict the sale of candles, matches etc.

    Maybe, the problem is with bedside lighting rather than halogen lamps. With LED long-life technology it should be possible to sell lamps with integral lamps.
     
  13. unphased

    unphased Screwfix Select

    Halogen lamps have always been a fire risk. Its been known since they were first released on to the market. It is VERY late in the day now start worrying over them. Like earlier posts said they are being phased out anyway under the EU Directive. They may even be phased out already, the only ones on sale now being ex-stock. I wonder if the UK would have bothered phasing them out if they weren't a member of the EU. I suppose when we come out of the EU, their Directives will no longer be mandatory for us. Interesting. I will to this day never understand why so many people decided to vote us out. Worst decision the UK public ever made.
     
    PaulBlackpool, MalcyB and chippie244 like this.
  14. Pollowick

    Pollowick Well-Known Member

    It is only the GLS type that are going, G4, G9, R7s and some specialists ones are not.
     
  15. unphased

    unphased Screwfix Select

    Hi Pollowick. Yes you are correct, I just checked. Hopefully they will get rid of those too eventually. Luckily they are not a popular bulb type and only floodlights will remain the biggest source of the R7s. LED seems to be dominating the market now as was expected.
     
  16. Pollowick

    Pollowick Well-Known Member

    I agree but there needs to be GOOD equivalents available at sensible prices. My lounge has 1 at 118mm and four 78mm plus two G9s and at present there are no LEDs that get anywhere near.
     
  17. MGW

    MGW Well-Known Member

    I would agree, when we moved from tungsten to CFL we also moved from a 3 bulb chandelier to a 5 bulb chandelier the latter with base at bottom so light reflected off the white ceiling. So 1978 when house built it had 2 x 100W this was changed to 6 x 40W and with LED is 10 x 5W so now using a 1/4 of the power that was used in 1979. However the move also required changing from a programmer and thermostat to a programmable thermostat so room temperature can be set higher in the evening to compensate for the heat not given out by the bulbs.

    Years ago living in a caravan the gas lamp was the only heating we had in the evening. And if one looks at camp site charges today with electric hook up compared with years ago where all you had was your gas bottle it seems we have gone backwards.

    However we would not dream of going to bed with a gas light on, dad bought a transformer that plugged into main light with a 6 volt bulb in the end as a night light for me, and a double adaptor so he could switch on big bulb if required, the type used so you could have light on and do ironing from light socket. They came from the days when lighting power cost less than socket power.

    But in the main items have warning on them today, so indoor use only, or not to be used by persons under 14 years old, and the quartz BA22d bulbs should have for ceiling rose use only, or not for use in standard or table lamps. It is not something one considers, today our stand alone heaters have switches in the base, so if knocked over they auto stop working. But not with a table or standard lamp.
     
  18. Severntrent

    Severntrent Active Member

    [QUOTE=". They came from the days when lighting power cost less than socket power.
    QUOTE]
    How did that work? I vaguely remember as a kid in the fifties Mum ironing from the lighting socket and the xmas tree lights ran off some sort of a double adapter plugged in the lighting socket but there was only one whizzzy around measuring wheel in the pantry adjacent cast iron fuse boxes and a 1 shilling slot machine
     
  19. MGW

    MGW Well-Known Member

    Before my time, think 30's? There were two meters supplying a home one for lights and one for power, and power was charged at a higher rate, seem to remember reading it was to get people to use electric lights as so many fires with gas, oil lights and candles.
     

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