Do I have too do this as well!

Discussion in 'Electricians' Talk' started by split load, Jul 16, 2006.

  1. split load

    split load New Member

    Just replaced a CU the other day, updated earth etc...all working fine. Was talking to an NIC inspector and he said that the old original lighting wiring in the loft which is routed, but over the josts and not on the sides needs changing!

    Is this right, if it is I need to add this cost in quotes! What's your experience with this?
     
  2. Ant1981

    Ant1981 New Member

    How do you mean by routed over the joists? Do you mean notches chiselled out?

    And on the sides, do you mean clipped direct to sides and routed through drilled holes?
     
  3. split load

    split load New Member

    How do you mean by routed over the joists? Do you
    mean notches chiselled out?
    - no just clipped ontop of joists at the sides of the building


    And on the sides, do you mean clipped direct to sides
    and routed through drilled holes?
    - no holes clippe don top of joist.

    My point here being this must mean a hell oif a lot of work for sparks in lofts as every house was wired this way in the old days!
     
  4. Ant1981

    Ant1981 New Member

    Yea it really shouldn't be at the top of joists, it could get damaged. Either cut some notches or drill holes and feed it though.

    It can be time consuming having to drill the holes, but I use a powerful SDS drill with an auger bit and it really cuts with power and speed!
     
  5. Ripped Off

    Ripped Off New Member

    Ant - Check the building regs wrt roof joists. Somewhere it states that you cant / should not drill roof joists.

    There is no reg which states that cables should be clipped on the side. As said its to protect the cable. If the cable is supported along its length on a board then nothing wrong with this.
     
  6. bs7671

    bs7671 New Member

    Cant drill or cut roof joists! Best to fit some running board and clip to them. Or just ignore the NIC bloke cause he is talking ****. It wont be long until tey say you have to re-wire every house to change a CU!
     
  7. Ant1981

    Ant1981 New Member

    Ant - Check the building regs wrt roof joists.
    Somewhere it states that you cant / should not drill
    roof joists.

    There is no reg which states that cables should be
    clipped on the side. As said its to protect the
    cable. If the cable is supported along its length on
    a board then nothing wrong with this.

    The regs state no closer than 50mm from the top or the bottom of joists.
     
  8. Just replaced a CU the other day, updated earth
    etc...all working fine. Was talking to an NIC
    inspector and he said that the old original lighting
    wiring in the loft which is routed, but over the
    josts and not on the sides needs changing!

    Is this right, if it is I need to add this cost in
    quotes! What's your experience with this?


    More NIC rubbish mate!
    It isnt often you find wires clipped to joists in the loft!
    I guess they didnt do it in the olden days.
    Im sure we aint supposed to drill the joists in the loft.
    Personally i always clip cable to sides of joist but i wouldnt ever expect a customer to pay for me to rewire his lighting just because the cables werent clipped!
     
  9. Ant1981

    Ant1981 New Member

    What if they want the loft boarded then? You've got cables clipped to the top of joists.

    What if people are putting things in the loft? The cables exposed at the top of the joists will get damaged. I've never not seen cables running through the joists.

    So long as your away from 50mm of the top and bottom, then its fine.

    Are we talking about the same joists? I'm thinking the joists that for the ceiling of the top floor. The floor of the loft?
     
  10. Building regs say drilling loft joists is not allowed!
    Just run the cables round the edge of the loft and clip to sides.If people want to lay flooring down then fine,let em notch the ******* joists.But i aint doing it because we were taught not to cause its against building regs!
     
  11. JP.

    JP. Screwfix Select

    Are you not allowed to shallow notch and then cover with a protector plate?
     
  12. ringmain

    ringmain Member

    So what is acceptable for boarded lofts? If the cables run over the top of the joists, is it acceptable to run the cables under the boards but over the joists - where packing has to be placed under the boards to level the loft. Or what about taking a chunk out of the tongue in the t&g and running the wire through that.

    Hanging offences?

    What if there's insulation in the loft. You have to apply a multiplier, don't you, but Ipresume that's generally OK.
     
  13. Ant1981

    Ant1981 New Member

    Are we talking about the same loft joists? How would you go from one light to the other if you cant pass through the joists?

    How can you run around the edge without using too much cable?

    Never been in a house where the cables have not passed through the joists.

    According to the regs so long as you are 50mm away from the top and the bottom, then it's fine.

    Where are you reading that it is not allowed?
     
  14. Ripped Off

    Ripped Off New Member

    Very true. Modern roof trusses are made to the lowest limits, held together with little more than tin can cleats.
    The regs are clear roof trusses are not to be drilled. ~As these are an integral unit then this includes the lower memeber, the section that is boarded for the ceiling below. Drilling a joist is not in the same league as a floor joist strength wise. They are non load bearing. Drilling holes only makes them more femur
     
  15. Ant1981

    Ant1981 New Member

    Not roof joists.

    Upstairs ceiling joists.

    Never had a builder say I can't do this.

    Only thing the regs say is no more than 50mm from the top or bottom, so that you don't weaken it.
     
  16. Very true. Modern roof trusses are made to the lowest
    limits, held together with little more than tin can
    cleats.
    The regs are clear roof trusses are not to be
    drilled. ~As these are an integral unit then this
    includes the lower memeber, the section that is
    boarded for the ceiling below. Drilling a joist is
    not in the same league as a floor joist strength
    wise. They are non load bearing. Drilling holes only
    makes them more femur

    SPOT ON!
     
  17. Ripped Off

    Ripped Off New Member

    Ant - With respect there are other regs we need to follow. In this case its the building regs. You are into the mire of BS7671 wrt joists.
    Think this comes under part A building structure. Will look when Ive 5 mins & let you know M8
     
  18. Ant1981

    Ant1981 New Member

    No, with respect. BS7671 is electrical regs, so ofcourse I didnt look there for joist drilling.

    I looked at the Electricians guide to the regs which covers what we need to know for our work. That's where it says 50mm from the top and bottom, so as to not weaken joists.
     
  19. What if they want the loft boarded then? You've got
    cables clipped to the top of joists.

    What if people are putting things in the loft? The
    cables exposed at the top of the joists will get
    damaged. I've never not seen cables running through
    the joists.


    DONT TALK **** ANT!
    I SUPPOSE EVERY LOFT U GO IN HAS THE CABLES CLIPPED ALL PRETTY LIKE AND HOLES DRILLED IN THE JOISTS!
    AND AS FOR YOU STATEMENT ABOUT USING TOO MUCH CABLE,WTF U ON ABOUT MAN?
    I'D RATHER USE ANOTHER 20M OF CABLE THAN HACK ALL THEM JOISTS AND HAVE THE CIELING FALL IN!
    DO ME A FAVOUR MATE!
     
  20. Ripped Off

    Ripped Off New Member

    Ant
    Have a look at page 238 of the electricians guide
    Section 11.11 states for Approved doc 'A'
    "Notches or holes must not be cut in roof rafters
     

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