EICR double check

Discussion in 'Electricians' Talk' started by DC70, Jul 13, 2021.

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  1. The Happy Builder

    The Happy Builder Screwfix Select

    Generally at least three hours on site, usually closer to four plus office work.

    If those test results are correct the “twenty minutes” comment is not to be taken seriously.
     
  2. The Happy Builder

    The Happy Builder Screwfix Select

    You’re thinking what I’m thinking, it’s easy to pick holes in it even with it being as brief as it is.
     
  3. ElecCEng

    ElecCEng Screwfix Select

    To do it properly all the appliances need to be unplugged and bulbs removed from all the light fittings. Anyone who can do that in 20 minutes is a better man than me…
     
  4. Sparkielev

    Sparkielev Screwfix Select

    This has all the markings of a van test, hasn't counted up points on each circuit, get some one else
     
  5. jonathanc

    jonathanc Screwfix Select

    And get money back on the first test….
     
    Sparkielev and ElecCEng like this.
  6. DC70

    DC70 New Member

    Thanks for the sanity check. The property has a "concierge" who logged the testers in and out time (he had to request and return keys to them) so I'm pretty confident the 20 minute timing was correct. It certainly seems the test was too superficial to be reliable. If nothing else, I can't see what would have limited his ability to test the water heater and lighting circuits. It's a 2 bed modern-ish flat where access is pretty straight forward.

    Thanks again for all the helpful insights.

    David
     
  7. Tony Goddard

    Tony Goddard Screwfix Select

    Unfortunately a lot of sparks have relatively little training in testing and yet still offer EICRs - I know a good few "Domestic Installers" genuine enough lads, who have done college and wired up a free standing stud wall, done a bit of new build site work, gone out on their own, really can only cope with new installation and yet still offer EICRs, most of this type arn't even insured for the EICR work. Some just look at it as a way of generating work changing CUs

    The mass rush to get all rental properties tested by April didn't help matters much!
     
  8. Tony Goddard

    Tony Goddard Screwfix Select

    The report is a joke, how can you put LIM against the supply type and number of live conductors!! (only against TNS!!)

    Also he has put N/A in the agreed limitations field, so there shouldn't be any limitations on such a small install

    What he has done is to stroll round with his tester, plugging into sockets, taking Zs and RCD times (you can do that in 20 mins) and made the rest up!!
     
  9. DC70

    DC70 New Member

    This is the element that has caught me. We lived in the property for 16 years, but having been unable to sell it, find ourselves as first-time landlords so that we can move on at least.
    David
     
  10. ElecCEng

    ElecCEng Screwfix Select

    Last ‘van test’ job I rectified had “unable to trace circuit 8” as a limitation. Turned out to be an easily identifiable shower circuit on an undersized cable. Neutral had melted to bare conductor which was touching the metal (recorded as plastic and needing replacement of course!) CU. Spark hadn’t even bothered to look inside. Criminal…
     
  11. Tony Goddard

    Tony Goddard Screwfix Select

    The reason he says there is a 50% chance the new CU will trip out is because he hasn't done any insulation tests (can't do that in 20 mins!!) , he's just put his meters infinity reading for each, so he doesn't know if there will be insulation faults or not.

    Had he done the EICR properly (and you didn't agree that he wouldn't do insulation testing) he could be fairly sure nothing would go wrong.

    At present he doesn't really know what will happen when he puts in the new CU and when that Neural Earth fault or shared neutral between circuits presents itself with a resounding "click" from the new RCD he will be asking for more cash to correct an issue he should know about now had he done the job right.
     
  12. The Happy Builder

    The Happy Builder Screwfix Select

    Now I can guess why there’s a limitation on the earthing arrangement, he probably did not go and inspect the intake in the communal meter room, presumably if there’s a concierge he could have got access even if it was locked.
     
  13. DC70

    DC70 New Member

    You are 100% correct - there is a communal meter room per floor which is locked, but the concierge would have opened it for him if he had requested it.

    I didn't request any special procedures other than not including an optional PAT test. The EICR test was booked "off the shelf" online.

    David
     
  14. ElecCEng

    ElecCEng Screwfix Select

    Same job as above. Unsat ‘EICR’ had >500M on all ccts for IR and R1+R2s. Visual of the lighting found E connected to N in a kitchen light fitting. Chance of tripping an RCD? 100%

     
  15. jonathanc

    jonathanc Screwfix Select

    As you have times when he logged in and out and a clear view that the test cannot be carried out in that time plus evidence he has not inspected the supply from the concierge, I suggest you do the following

    1. write to them stating the inspection is manifestly erroneous and incomplete. Give them 28 days to return your money

    2.get the evidence of times from the concierge

    3.wait 28 days and if no money received issue a small claim. You have black and white evidence from the timing he was there to say the inspection was not carried out. The electrician has no chance
     
    candoabitofmoststuff likes this.
  16. ElecCEng

    ElecCEng Screwfix Select

    How much did you pay? if you’re in London anything under the £200 mark you’ll never get a full inspection…

    A few landlords i’ve done work for claim they’ve been ‘ripped off’ for paying £150 in the counties when they only pay £49 for an EICR in The City…

     
  17. DC70

    DC70 New Member

    The cost was £99 from a company that brands itself as a specialist in landlord safety checks. That price was for a 1 or 2 bed property. Their price for a 5 bed house is £150. Now that I know it should have been 3-4 hours work, I can see that £99 doesn't sound sufficient. The location was East London.
    David
     
  18. jonathanc

    jonathanc Screwfix Select

    Van test price to generate work…
     
  19. The Happy Builder

    The Happy Builder Screwfix Select

    It is the governments fault, they have not provided a set of minimum requirements for the landlords EICRs and for the qualifications or experience required by the person providing the report, there is no requirement for the inspector to be registered with the NECIEC or NAPIT so there may not be an organisation who can arbitrate if you are are not satisfied with the report and service provided, neither has the Government actually stated what the minimum standards are for the electrical installations themselves leaving people trying to interpret the requirements of the electrical installations in different ways.

    You are a victim of the government failing to plan correctly and setting out minimum requirements for installations and the people inspecting them, because they don't know what is involved, then refusing to extend the implementation date because of the Coronavirus lockdowns.

    I suspect I would have signed the installation off as safe to use with possibly some recommendations for improvement.
     
  20. DC70

    DC70 New Member

    The contractor is registered with NICEIC. One other thing I noticed is that the person whos signature is on EICR report is different to the name of the person who actually attended and did the inspection. Is that allowed?
    David
     

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