Fit rsj to allow flat ceiling

Discussion in 'Builders' Talk' started by Lee2020, Feb 14, 2020.

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  1. Lee2020

    Lee2020 New Member

    Hi. I’d like to remove an internal wall between my kitchen and dinning room only the floor joist for upstairs sit on the wall. I’ve been looking at joist fixings and see it’s possible to fit timber in the web of the rsj and use hangers to support the joists. Guess my question is as anyone had any experience in doing this with joists and floor in situ taking some boards up upstairs? Is it likely possible? Not had the calcs done yet and they may not even like that idea but before I asked was just looking for other people’s thoughts. Many thanks
     
  2. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    Yes it’s possible, have done it many times. You need a structural engineers sign off to specify a beam size to cover your behind and you should inform your local building control of what you are undertaking.
     
    CGN likes this.
  3. Lee2020

    Lee2020 New Member

    Thanks for the response. Just waiting for the engineer to find a day come and shall discuss this method with him. As long as he agrees my plan was to make holes in the walls below where the rsj is to be fitted then mark and cut the joists. Then lift the rsj up and prop then build in the pad stone and rsj. Does this method sound about right? One last thing I would plan to make the cuts as tight as possible but how crucial is this? Thanks again.
     
  4. stevie22

    stevie22 Screwfix Select

    Bean size will be the same whether its under the floor or in its thickness.

    It is a lot more work to hide the beam and you will often need a pier at the ends anyway so to me a full frame around the opening is visually better. Often find ceilings don't quite line up so start having to do loads of skimming to get truly flat result.
     
  5. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select


    You worryingly haven’t mentioned acrow props o_O
     
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  6. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select


    I’ll respectfully disagree, it’s a bit more work granted but I think it’s a far better finish having a seamless finish, a bulkhead on show always looks ‘boxy’ in my opinion, can look good in an older home but for a modern look and neat rows of spotlights I far prefer one large ceiling.
     
  7. Severntrent

    Severntrent Screwfix Select

    I think you worry to much Jord , even the most inept DIYer must realise that you can't knock a wall out and cut the joists in half and expect the ceiling to stay up
     
    Jord86 likes this.
  8. Lee2020

    Lee2020 New Member

    Yes I shall be using props I just thought it a given. Am great full for the concern though. I would much rather a flat ceiling but guess if need be it’s would have to be made a feature. I have fitted a few rsj’s in the past without need for a pier at work but these are on solid brick wall local authority houses. This was my other thing take up with the engineer I have a brick wall one side to the lounge but the back wall of the house is hollow pots.
     
  9. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select


    You say that........o_O
     
  10. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    I will say though that in my experience of doing what the thread is about, the hardest part is trying to cut through joists from underneath with floorboards still in situ up above, for whatever the reason may be, carpets etc. Use a chainsaw is the easiest, handsaw the hardest, multitool the most accurate, a combo of handsaw and multitool the best in my opinion. Whatever the width of the RSJ is, allow 5mm or 3/16ths if you’re ancient, the beam will then bump up with a bit of persuasion.
     
  11. Hfs

    Hfs Active Member

    Might get away with a flitch beam.
     
  12. Lee2020

    Lee2020 New Member

    Thanks all shall see what the engineer says when he comes.
     
  13. Lee2020

    Lee2020 New Member

    Hi. I’ve had my calcs back and just to clarify I can take the floor boards up above for access I just ment it was already fitted. My only real remaining question is if you fit timber into the web I’m taking it you pick a timber the depth of the web then fix the joists to that with hangers. Which hangers? Also have is the timber fixed in the rsj.
     
  14. Jimmycloutnail

    Jimmycloutnail Active Member

    Your SE should give you some connection details? If not get the steel drilled at 600mm centres from your supplier, or hire a mag drill if you prefer but would cost more for just one beam as you’ll have to buy the bit. Then bolt the closest size timber into the web. Screw scaffold boards across the joists doubled up and support with acros, knock wall down. make sure you cut away a decent amount of the plaster board so you can work, take floor boards up and away you go.
     

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