Fitting a tall units that are too tall to fit the ceiling height - options please?

Discussion in 'Kitchen Fitters' Talk' started by Busterhymen, Jan 9, 2022.

  1. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    Hi experienced kitchen fitters.

    I would like to fit a new kitchen and wish to know the options & ideas to get around an issue please.

    The floor board to ceiling measures 2.33m, but a tall larder is specified as 2.34m (inc 15cm legs/plinth). I also want to fit 90cm tall wall units (B&Q).

    I have thought about trimming the larder & door down by 1cm and dropping the tall wall units down by 1cm to match the top, and they'll still be plenty of room between the worktop and underside of wall units.

    Then I thought about simply dropping the whole kitchen by 1cm (on the legs), cutting the plinth to 14cm instead of 15cm.

    Then I realised that I have to hook the wall units over a bracket by placing them higher than the position they'll drop to, meaning I may need to either trim the larder or drop the kitchen by a FURTHER 1cm to allow for the lifting and dropping over the wall hanger.

    If I do wish to peruse the tall unit option, what's the best way forward please?
     
  2. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Screwfix Select

    The best way forward in my opinion is to use 720mm wall units along with the correct height tall units to match. Dropping the base cab height 20mm is a big deal for anyone that is even normal height, if your approaching 6ft it can pose serious problems with your back in the long run.
    Not only that, if you went with 900mm wall units, even reducing base cab height by 20mm will still mean you wont be able to fit any cornice on top of the wall units. Also you won't have enough room above the wall units to fit LED drivers for any under cab lighting.
     
  3. WillyEckerslike

    WillyEckerslike Screwfix Select

    You might find there's sufficient adjustment in the wall hanging brackets to hook over the rail and then wind them up to the height you want.
    In this instant I would hang the wall units first as high as you can get them and then offer up the tall larder unit to match. The risk in this situation is that you end up with your worktop lower than you want and give yourself backache. I would rule out a thin laminate and choose your worktop thickness accordingly once you've done your maths. A thin floor covering will also help.
     
    Busterhymen, kitfit1 and Truckcab79 like this.
  4. Truckcab79

    Truckcab79 Screwfix Select

    I’ve fitted plenty of kitchens but I’m not a kitchen fitter.
    Personally I’d start at your chosen worktop height. This is normally 900mm but can be whatever you find comfortable. That alone will affect your leg and plinth height as will the depth of worktop you’ve chosen, so don’t get too hung up on the plinths being 140/150. I’ve never fitted one that didn’t need trimming. Also affected by how level your floor is etc.

    Larders, if they follow on from wall units (or even if they don’t from an aesthetic point of view) will need to match the height of the wall units exactly. Otherwise your cornice ( if you’re having one) won’t run at the same level when it meets the larder. Bear in mind that cornice also need to fit so you could fit wall units then fill gap with cornice (though you’ll have to fix it from underneath). You can also fill the top gap with material matching the units, scribed in to fit perfectly. Again, don’t assume that your ceiling is perfectly level across the whole room.

    I’d start with your worktop, then ideal larder height, then start marking it all on a wall to see where it sits. Laser level is invaluable for see how far out your walls, ceilings and floor are, not to mention for the actual fitting.
     
    Kitfit and Busterhymen like this.
  5. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    Many thanks.
    I'm not worried about the driver (it could go in a canopy hood bridging unit or the top of a tall fridge/freezer/larder), but you are correct and I have explained to the Mrs that I wouldn't manage to fit cornice. I may be able to 'slip-in' a piece of matching furniture board at the top though (I think)?
    I'm 5'9" and she's 5'. She thought the worktop height wouldn't be an issue because people sometimes fit 10mm instead of 40mm worktops these days, which is 30mm lower than standard anyway, but they don't sell plinth 30mm larger to compensate the loss of worktop height or do they?
    I did offer another option (trimming the top of the larder/door and dropping the wall units 10/20mm to match - what do you think of that please?
    I do realise that using 'standard' instead of 'tall' is the easy option, but wifey wants to maximise the space to the ceiling!
     
    kitfit1 likes this.
  6. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    Many thanks. If I loosen/adjust the hangers(so they are sloppy), could I hold them up high with soft tape (or something) before hooking over the bracket, then adjust them to the highest position, thus maximising their potential height? My old kitchen had back rails on the wall units, allowing them to be screwed straight to the wall.
    Good news on the floor - it's great condition green chipboard and I'm hoping to use 6mm built-in underlay LVT which is in my favour.
     
  7. Truckcab79

    Truckcab79 Screwfix Select

    You might be lucky and do that but check all your levels first. The brackets adjust for a reason and if you start by fitting them so the first ones are at their highest point you lose all the adjustability you’ll need when you get to the run on the other side of the room and find out that the floor or ceiling isn’t perfectly and you need it to be higher still.
     
  8. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    Thanks for your reply.
    I have checked the dimensions and used a laser level. It's amazingly consistent & square. I've already accepted that I wouldn't be able to fit a full size cornice.
     
  9. Truckcab79

    Truckcab79 Screwfix Select

    Good news. I’ve never been that lucky!

    with regard to your question about different sized plinths I don’t think they are regularly available. Standard is 150mm so generally you just cut them down. Only issue is in the unlikely even that you need them higher than 150mm.
     
  10. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    I'm fairly sure with the BQ units that they state overall high, including legs set at 150mm
    But they can be lowered to 125mm minimum - basically adjustable foot fully wound in so you gain 25mm and trim the plinths to fit

    Not sure if this helps
     
    Busterhymen likes this.
  11. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    It confirms my understanding and is why I suggested one option is to drop all my larder/base units by 10/20mm and trimming the plinth down to match, but there appears to be a concern that the worktop would also drop 10/20mm and be too low for comfort.

    They did a design with 10mm worktop for me, but they never swapped the plinths from 150 to 180mm to compensate (just checked the 2 designs). Looking in the book/website, there's only one plinth size anyway.

    So the worktop height is 150 + 720 + 40 = 910 for a 40mm worktop or 150 + 720 + 10 = 880 for a 10mm worktop. Well, I'm only talking about dropping the 910 (40mm worktop) design down by 20mm to 890mm (within their normal 880 to 910 range) or am I missing something?

    I'm just trying to learn to help me understand the best options if I did go the tall route please?
     
  12. Truckcab79

    Truckcab79 Screwfix Select

    what you say makes sense for the worktop but as per my earlier comment you need to look at worktop height AND larder height. The larder is one piece so you can’t have it lowered to match the base cabinets AND mess around with it’s finished height. If you lower the base units you also have to lower the larder otherwise nothing matches. The base of the larder will sit above the level of the rest of your kitchen and your doors won’t line up.

    You can of course ignore this if you larder units are physically detached from the rest of the base units. Preferably by some distance so the discrepancy is not noticed.
     
  13. Truckcab79

    Truckcab79 Screwfix Select

    upload_2022-1-9_22-39-28.jpeg

    Not a very good picture with that hop-up in the way but these are larder units alongside a run of base units. You can see what I mean. Base of all the units needs to be the same or the doors don’t match. That height in turn dictates the finished height of the larder which dictates the finished height of the wall units.
     
  14. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    Apologies, I don't understand. The base and Larder units are on the same legs, so why can't I drop the WHOLE kitchen by 20mm and it all match (top and bottom)? All the 'on show' sides are 'replacement', NOT 'clad-on'. The tall larder door combinations are available with 720 bottom doors to match the base units and fit a 70/30 fridge freezer too.
     
  15. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Screwfix Select

    If the doors that you have chosen are "Slab" doors, then of course you can reduce the height of the tall housing and cut the top of the top door on the tall housing to suite. If they are "framed" doors as in @Truckcab79's pic above, then you can't really cut the top off of the top door because it will look completely wrong.
    What type of doors are you planning on having ?
     
    Busterhymen likes this.
  16. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    Arh... I now understand your concern. Thinking of 'handleless' where the top of the wall units and the bottom of the base units would be square edged slab finish. Does this mean that you think it could work if I'm prepared to trim down the larder and achieve a good finished edge?
     
  17. Truckcab79

    Truckcab79 Screwfix Select

    You can. Perhaps I’m misunderstanding you as you have talked about both dropping the height of the kitchen which of course you can do, but also I understood you want the units as high up as possible. You can have one but not both as the larder unit is a fixed dimension. Unless of course you start cutting it down but I personally wouldn’t, and as Kitfit suggests only possible with slab doors.

    I would just fit the larder at its full height and adjust the kitchen down to suit without messing around trimming the larder unit down.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2022
  18. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Screwfix Select

    Yes, absolutely you can, we do this regularly when fitting kitchens with 900mm wall cabs. It can only be done with "slab" or handleless doors though. In fact, you can reduce the height of the tall housing enough to be able to fit cornice on the top and leave a 10mm shadow gap above the cornice.
    That can be done while still setting the base cabs at normal height. The only downside is that the height between the wall cabs and the worktop will be less than it otherwise would be. Which for your wife at 5ft tall is no bad thing at all :)
     
    Busterhymen likes this.
  19. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    I'm talking about either shortening the larder and its top door by 20mm to fit the ceiling height and match 20mm lower then standard wall units (without cutting them), thus reducing the gap between worktop & wall unit by 20mm, with keeping standard base unit height.

    OR

    Dropping the whole kitchen by 20mm (all units) without cutting any unit to fit the ceiling, and having to cut 20mm off the plinth to fit the units being lower on the legs.
     
  20. Busterhymen

    Busterhymen Active Member

    Great - that's exactly one of the options that I was trying to describe.
     
    kitfit1 likes this.

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