Gargling boiler + receiver not communicating

Discussion in 'Plumbers' Talk' started by SpaceTofu, Jan 5, 2018.

  1. SpaceTofu

    SpaceTofu Member

    Hi all.

    Had a bit of a funny boiler since Christmas. The boiler is a Vokera 25C.
    It started gargling back then, read some stuff online and poured some hot water on the condensation pipe outside (we have had some very cold days some days before).
    It seemed to have worked but then we haven't been in the house.
    We came back to the house to find the temperature at 25.5C (!), when the settings are on 20C max.
    So went on google again and found many results pointing at the deviator / zone / three way valve being potentially stuck / broken.
    Lot of easy fixes on internet for this kind of valve pictured below[​IMG]
    but the divertor valve in my boiler is embedded into the unit.
    Took the unit apart, disassembled the divertor valve, and the gears/cogs didn't seem to be working fine to me. I therefore ordered a new unit, fitted it this morning, nothing much has changed.

    I then realised that we came back to a 25.5C house because the Salus receiver is not working as expected. Red LED is on as you'd expect, and green LED is on as you's expect when the thermostat is on, but it doesn't fire the boiler up. As soon as I switch off the Salus receiver, the boiler fires up as I assume it then uses the heating knob temperature setting to determine at what temp shall the heating water be.

    In the meantime this morning the gargling noises have restarted (hopefully I am able to upload the file recording)

    I fear I am facing two problems here. I heard the Salus customer support is actually quite good, will give them a call later. Assuming a new Salus receiver unit will fix the heating temperature control issues, I am definitely still faced with the gargling issue. What could that be?

    thanks all

    PS: we have two chimney on the roof, but one of the pipes obviously just is venting though the room directly as opposed to the boiler.
    Is this done according to reg (e.g. there needs to be a fresh air inflow in the boiler room) or just a botch job done when the boiler was installed and supposedly there was an old boiler where the grey pipe is?
    One would hope that the pipe going out from the boiler would be enough?
    I am asking because there is a huge amount of cold air pulling through the grey pipe.

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Mike83

    Mike83 Screwfix Select

    Take a picture of the top of the boiler.
    The gargling could be a blocked condensate pipe inside the boiler.
    The grey pipe could be old and no longer required.
    What’s the model of boiler.
     
  3. SpaceTofu

    SpaceTofu Member

    the model of the boiler is a Vokera Easi-heat Plus 25C.
    On top of the boiler there isn't much happening in terms of piping

    [​IMG]

    I have the feeling the grey pipe is there because of a potential old boiler that used to be there, just wanted to make sure whether there are regs that state that one has to have an extra inflow of fresh air from outside into a boiler room?
    How would I go about finding a condensated pipe inside the boiler?
    The boiler is open already

    [​IMG]


    here is a link to the boiler gargling when I opened the hot water
    https://vocaroo.com/i/s19guZ8aOpF5
    here now that the CH is on
    https://vocaroo.com/i/s1VasFaeccbw

    The pressure is now at 1.5 bar and I feel like the gargling increases with the pressure. Also the gargling comes and goes, yesterday we didn't have any gargling at all.
     
  4. Mike83

    Mike83 Screwfix Select

    The grey pipe seems redundant. Was probably for ventilation for previous boiler.
    In your last photo, the side view of your boiler. To the right hand side is the boilers trap. The pipe that enters this from above could be blocked. This is part of the flue technically so isn’t a diy job to remove and refit it.
     
  5. SpaceTofu

    SpaceTofu Member

    yes, I am not prepared and willing to be doing work on the gas part of the boiler, I opened it simply because I thought replacing the divertor valve would cure it all, but actually the valve has seemingly being ok from the start.
    Trying now to source a new Salus receiver and will book in a boiler man to have a look at it.

    Really concerned and upset that someone would have left an unused pipe unblocked just to save some time, so much wind is coming through!!

    Thank you so much for your help Mike!
     
  6. Mike83

    Mike83 Screwfix Select

    If the white pipe is blocked once it’s removed some water will come from the connection. Some towels under the boiler would be advised. It may only be partially blocked,so as the boiler is running and producing waste it’s backing up into the boiler and gargling.
    If the boilers not been used for a couple of hours the gargling may not be as evident.
    What room is the boiler in? Can’t think of any use for the grey pipe as it isn’t terminated correctly for ventilation.
     
  7. The Teach

    The Teach Screwfix Select

    The condense could be draining away very slowly,it needs to be checked and maybe get an expert to visit.

    Also ask the expert to investigate why water has been dripping down the top & rhs of the boiler,thou it could be historic and already repaired.

    The salus situation needs looking into,the supplied vokera mechanical clock has been removed from the fascia and left sitting adjacent to the siphon. Is this still electrically connected ?

    Also consider this boiler has auto frost protection and when you were away from the property it could have activated,a few thoughts :)
     
  8. SpaceTofu

    SpaceTofu Member

    thank you all for your responses and sorry for my delay in replying to those, but had been sent away for work.

    Mike83, I sort of followed your advice and shook (not too violently) the white/transparent trap pipe and something quite material went down the drain, could hear it running all the way around the pipes and then behind the toilet and down in the ground. Since then no more gargling!
    Further, the boiler is in the "boiler room", just a small space between kitchen and bathroom. I am more so inclined to think there was an old boiler there (we know this temperamental boiler of ours was installed two years ago) so it kinda explains that the grey pipe could have been the exhaust pipe of the previous boiler.

    The Teach, I am not sure what you mean with water dripping down the top? Is that white limescale deposit you are referring to? Thanks for the tip, I will surely do so!
    The mechanical clock is connected electrically (at least, visually I can see that there is a cable), will try and see whether the clock is actually moving. I doubt it has been removed from the fascia though, as there isn't any unused slot in the fascia of the boiler?

    As mentioned, was away this last couple days and I returned to a normally heated house (19 C) and judging by the gas reading, the gas has been used in a normal amount meanwhile away.
    I am still unsure it is all fixed now as I keep hearing the water circulating through the heating system and I am pretty sure it didn't use to do so?

    Will have a boiler man to do the yearly service hopefully soon, it is just a nightmare to find an engineer willing to service a boiler around here!
     
  9. SpaceTofu

    SpaceTofu Member

    the time on the clock is moving forward, hence it is electrically connected to the boiler
     
  10. The Teach

    The Teach Screwfix Select

  11. SpaceTofu

    SpaceTofu Member

    The Teach, I tried the Vokera number, but they have been absolutely useless. They cannot book an appointment for me now because they are too busy, need to call in a month but they cannot guarantee that we will be able to book an appointment then, because they will still be very busy.

    Anyway, I got home to 11C the other day, so that's it, and I got a new thermostat / receiver, a Netatmo one.

    Problem is, the wiring is slightly more complicated then I have imagined and yes, I can now confirm that that bogus timer is actually connected to the circuits.
    Essentially, the black and grey wires (COM / NO, and do I understand right that they are interchangeable?!) from the receiver go into the PCB of the boiler.
    Actually, the grey one connects to a connector soldered onto the PCB (see below), the black one connects into the white cable connector to the red cable coming out of the timer.
    The black cable coming out of the timer connects in the other port of the connector soldered onto the PCB.

    [​IMG]

    Shall I just remove the timer and all of its pertinent connections (anyway the timer is constantly set on ON) and connect directly the grey/black wires (COM/NO) into the connector soldered onto the PCB?
    As I asked earlier, does it make a difference at all whether I swap around the grey and black wires of the receiver?
    Thank you
     
  12. SpaceTofu

    SpaceTofu Member

    In the end, it turned out that the motherboard was faulty; not a surprise really seeing that the boiler did work, simply had a mind of its own.
    Thanks all for the help
     

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