Gas pipes - What are the rules

Discussion in 'Engineers' Talk' started by Bridgewarden, Dec 8, 2003.

  1. Bridgewarden

    Bridgewarden New Member

    Can gas pipes be run via loft from meter to kitchen?

    Where can I find info on rules

    Thanks for any advice
  2. supersparky

    supersparky New Member

    Unless your corgi your not allowed to go anyware near em so dont know why your asking? and i think its unlikly that any corgi will put his name to your work....but yes they can go in loft...
  3. Pugley

    Pugley Member

    If you do a search on "gas" you will find a whole plethora of information on gas and pipes.

    As I have stated before a pipe is not a gas pipe until it has gas in it. Anybody can run pipework within their house but only a CORGI registered person can connect that pipe to a gas supply and commission an appliance.

    It is the responsibility of the CORGI person to test the pipe and appliance to ensure all HSC regulations are adhered to before handing the installation over to the customer.

    You ask about routing a pipe via a loft? The volume of gas required, diameter and length of the pipe have to be considered in addition to basic safety of the pipe run. So it very much depends on what appliances you wish to supply.(in the same way as diameter of electric cables dictates current carrying capacity - except gas pipes dont get hot when overloaded!)

    For example in a 30 metre run of 22mm pipe it is possible to supply 2.3 cubic metres/hour (approx 25KW). Over a short run of 6 metres the same pipe could supply 5.8cubic metres/hour (approx 64KW).

    This information is supplied in the ACS course notes used for CORGI accreditation but I have not seen it published elsewhere.

    In summary you can do your own pipework if you understand how much gas is needed but you will have to get a CORGI person to test and commission your appliances. I dont think any registered CORGI engineer would have a problem with that. In fact why not contact someone in your locality for advice.

    Hope this helps
  4. Bridgewarden

    Bridgewarden New Member

    Thanks for the reply Pugley

    You could not have known, but I do know all about pipe sizeing. I was a building services engineer until 10 years ago and used to designed gas boiler houses for industrial premises and power stations. But my knowledge of domestic rules are minimal and I wanted to know if it was allowed to run a main in a domestic attic, or did it have to be outside to as near the point of use as possible. Not the case in industry. By the way the CIBS used to publishes tables of the flow of fluids (gas,air water etc)in their Guide.

    Thanks again

  5. supersparky

    supersparky New Member

    pugly- you sure you should be sayin that anyone can put in a gas pipe? sure it can be done legaly like you say, but i know no plumbers that will put their name to a pipe by someone else if its for gas...

  6. Ben

    Ben New Member

    Today at work, I asked our Corgi plumber about gas pipes and who is allowed to install them. He said that if you know in advance that the pipe will be for gas, you can't even run the pipework unless you are Corgi. And seeing as gas pipe tends to be bigger than water pipe, it might be hard to prove you didn't intend for the pipe to be filled with gas one day...
    Saying that, his taps leaked at the end of the day, so I don't know if I want to believe a plumber who gets leaks on his sink taps! Haha!
  7. Pugley

    Pugley Member

    SS - you do raise an interesting issue about who can install gas pipes. I am qualified to work on gas appliances and pipework but I am certainly not a lawyer.

    The law (HSC Installation and use of gas Reg 22/151)clearly states that "no person shall permit gas to pass into the installation pipework unless he has caused such purging and testing and other be carried out"

    What I understand that to mean in legal terms is that I as the "competent person" could be prosecuted if I connected gas to installation pipework without ensuring ALL safety regulations are complied with.

    In the real world it quite normal to be called out to replace and/or install appliances on existing pipework. I believe the buck stops with me to ensure that I am certain that the installation meets with regulations and is safe before handing it over to the customer.

    Certainly on new builds the CORGI guy will have to test all installation pipework (could have been done by a plumber!) BEFORE it is connected to the metered supply and any appliances are commissioned.

    Because there will always be "existing pipework" in a property my understanding is that the law is written to ensure that the CORGI chappy takes nothing for granted and check everything.

    This must be similar for a sparks who has to test an installation before completing an inspection certificate?(some of which may have already existed)

    I hope there will folk out there with other views that would be very welcome on this debate.
  8. supersparky

    supersparky New Member

    yea i agree pugley, it will be interesting to see what people say...prehaps worth posting on the plumbers forum?

  9. gav

    gav New Member

    i asked this one a few weeks ago and i got so many different answers . so i phoned corgi,,,,,they say ,yes you can,,,,,,,,so there ,,lol,,,,,,,,,,corgi guy will test ,commission and certify
  10. supersparky

    supersparky New Member

    i think you will find that a corgi registered plumber either wont or will be reluctant to put his name to your work

  11. Pugley

    Pugley Member

    This could go on for a while?

    What happens if the customer complains to CORGI that you refuse to test and commission his/her pipe just because you didn't put it??? (no pun intended - much)

    I would say 95% of pipes are already there in one way or another if a property already has gas.
  12. supersparky

    supersparky New Member

    yes but the assumption would be made that it was done by pro, or before corgi,i doubt corgi will force their members to do anything, nic dont, if a nic sparks said he wernt gunna put his name to s diyers work he wouldent be forced to, incedently i asked a corgi and he said he said that he wouldent do it. so....

  13. kesh

    kesh New Member

    Best to watch your ars*!
  14. gav

    gav New Member

    lol,,so now corgi fitters assume existing pipework was installed by a professional do they,,,,lol
    sorry,,,,,but that statement makes a mockery of corgi registration
    especially the bit about pipework fitted b4 corgi was introduced. the whole point about corgi ,is safety,,,not who did it
  15. supersparky

    supersparky New Member

    MAKES A MOKERY!!!?!? dont make me laugh! ive just seen today a gas engeneer, corgi regd, shimmy across a tiled roof, no ladder, no boards, what if one of the tiles gave? also been round somones house and all the BG engineers do each year is sweep the fire out, no tests or anything... What do you make of that for a mockery?
    im saying taht on an instalation that is a number o0f years old, they will assume that its ALL up to scratch because it has had no problems...You realy think that the guy who is commin to install the boiler next year will smash the screed up in my 30+ yr old flat to look at every joint? dont make me laugh mate!
    are you corgi?

  16. rusty

    rusty New Member

    i dont think smashing a floor up would be necessary, i may be wrong but common sense would suggest that an engineer wou pressure test a system as a matter of course whenever they do some work on the system, thats about all you need to do to make sure a system is installed ok, or at least not leaking, no matter who installed it. i think it would very foolish to assume all previouse work is up to scratch and not bother checking it.

  17. supersparky

    supersparky New Member

    and you are a gas engineer?
    or have you ever worked on the site with one?
    the tendancy seems to be, turn the gas on and walk round with a meter testing your work, pressure testing? what if the leak is so small that you would have to leave the pipe under test for hours to see any difference? or if that last piece of screed is stopping the leak?
    dont give me bullshite about mockery of corgi, some of em do it emselfs! u never see the one who ****** in the sink on national tv?!?!

  18. jmcbuilders

    jmcbuilders New Member

    Hi i am not getting drawn into disputes but you have to do a drop test on all connections they are timed and if it was that small it would not register on the test.

  19. Charlie Far!ey

    Charlie Far!ey New Member

    17 posts on Gas Pipes! - This is not natural - Install in steel or copper and test them with an air test - invite a CORGI guy to certificate them and you have your problems solved - You are making a mountain out of a mole hill. Gas pipes are almost a forgettable item so stop making it the biggest issue since concrete cancer.

    It's simple so do it guys!


  20. Pugley

    Pugley Member

    CF in case you hadn't noticed, not much has been happening on this part of the forum for days - and then you come along with your well written common sense and spoil it all.

    Yule be making peace on the plumbers forum next. Who needs this Santa goodwill thing anyway. Bah humbug

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