Astramax
Super Member
No, it's the labour party representative chipping away at your final salary pension.
Heating allowance...what's next to go for seniors?
- Thread starter Astramax
- Start date
ReflexAngle2023
Active Member
Back on topic wouldn't it just be simpler just to pay the cold weather heating allowance to all pensioners but make it taxable? Those who didn't need it ie. those earning above the agreed 'living wage' of £24,000/year would be taxed for the full amount back. Those with income above their personal allowance but under the 'living wage' would be taxed on it proportionally.
Good idea?
My other hobby horse concerns the iniquitous, unfairness of council tax. Scrap it entirely and introduce a local income tax with personal allowance set so that those on the lower end of the financial scale might not pay anything. Being based on income not some random accident of house valuation it would surely be fairer all round.
For instance as a single person I'm paying three times as much for my council services as neighbours living in a similar size property (design for a maximum of two adults and a young child) with, somehow, three working age adults, one non-working adult and two children living there.
Good idea?
My other hobby horse concerns the iniquitous, unfairness of council tax. Scrap it entirely and introduce a local income tax with personal allowance set so that those on the lower end of the financial scale might not pay anything. Being based on income not some random accident of house valuation it would surely be fairer all round.
For instance as a single person I'm paying three times as much for my council services as neighbours living in a similar size property (design for a maximum of two adults and a young child) with, somehow, three working age adults, one non-working adult and two children living there.
Astramax
Super Member
that was POLL TAX!
WillyEckerslike
Screwfix Select
1. Have you applied for the single person council tax discount discount? I don't know if it's universal but I'm aware it exists in more than one authority.
Astramax
Super Member
edit...that's why on paper POLL TAX was a favourable idea.
Was always a discount of 25%. As far as I know, it's still available.
quasar9
Screwfix Select
Taxation is a strange thing! A very low levels it is ineffective as it won’t allow the government to progress the nation effectively (education, health, defence etc) but at higher levels it saps the will to create wealth. Not just money but investment which leads to job creation multiplying the wealth creation.
it’s an extremely fine line.
UK oscillates between the two as the flavour of govt changes.
it’s an extremely fine line.
UK oscillates between the two as the flavour of govt changes.
Alan22
Screwfix Select
It is a common myth that Labour raise and Conservative lower taxes, each successive government since 1974 followed the previous, the only party to break that trend is the previous conservative one which raised taxes more than any other government, the opposite of the myth.
ReflexAngle2023
Active Member
A local income tax on individuals would be absolutely nothing like the rightly despised Thatcher era concept of a poll tax. That was flat rate and took no account of an individual's income or ability to pay and deserved to be consigned to the dustbin of bad tax ideas.
A local income tax, with a personal allowance would mean the poorest might not pay anything and would be proportional to the income of the individual. So multi-occupant properties might not pay anything, in total, or as much as they are paying now either. That is as fair as you can make taxation surely.
As for the council tax's single persons "benefit" that, of course still exists (don't give this government any ideas in that respect) and is indeed 25% less than the 'full' council tax in the same property band. They have, at last, stopped calling it a "benefit" and now call it a "discount". It is in fact an unfair tariff on single persons whatever you call it.
I can give my figures as an example, as said, for a practically identical size property: a maisonette in outer London designed for a maximum of two adults and a young child. Both properties have had single adult occupancy for the majority of the last 46 years because that is what they were primarily designed for.
As a single person I pay roughly £1500/year for my council tax, that's with the "discount". The family in the other property are four adults: three working and two school age children. They pay the "full" council tax of roughly £2000/year. So each adult is effectively getting their council services for £500/year.
How is that fair taxation?
Put simply: if two plus people have to pay £2000/year for their council services why does a single person living in the same size property have to pay £1500 not £1000?
A local income tax, with a personal allowance would mean the poorest might not pay anything and would be proportional to the income of the individual. So multi-occupant properties might not pay anything, in total, or as much as they are paying now either. That is as fair as you can make taxation surely.
As for the council tax's single persons "benefit" that, of course still exists (don't give this government any ideas in that respect) and is indeed 25% less than the 'full' council tax in the same property band. They have, at last, stopped calling it a "benefit" and now call it a "discount". It is in fact an unfair tariff on single persons whatever you call it.
I can give my figures as an example, as said, for a practically identical size property: a maisonette in outer London designed for a maximum of two adults and a young child. Both properties have had single adult occupancy for the majority of the last 46 years because that is what they were primarily designed for.
As a single person I pay roughly £1500/year for my council tax, that's with the "discount". The family in the other property are four adults: three working and two school age children. They pay the "full" council tax of roughly £2000/year. So each adult is effectively getting their council services for £500/year.
How is that fair taxation?
Put simply: if two plus people have to pay £2000/year for their council services why does a single person living in the same size property have to pay £1500 not £1000?
quasar9
Screwfix Select
Local taxes are arbitrary at best, often drawn up by people whose grasp of economy is tenuous at the best. If you take the london boroughs and split them into inner and outer to make comparison fair, there is a huge disparity between them regards to council tax and charge for services like parking. At the end of the day the cost of providing services do not change much across london. One can only assume that the high cost councils are wasting funds to a greater degree than the low cost ones.
my worry is that with the incoming govt promising to devolve yet more power to local councils will lead to balkanisation. This is already happening in parts of london where non residents in one borough are not allowed to use minor roads. Just imagine if it’s neighbours retaliated with the sane measure
my worry is that with the incoming govt promising to devolve yet more power to local councils will lead to balkanisation. This is already happening in parts of london where non residents in one borough are not allowed to use minor roads. Just imagine if it’s neighbours retaliated with the sane measure
Astramax
Super Member
Council Tax valuation is based on the property not the person, for a single occupation you receive a privileged and generous 25% discount.
The Community Charge or "Poll Tax" (as in "per head") was an excellent idea, where people over the age of majority paid, and there was in fact a reduction for people with lower household incomes. It was supposed to replace the worse "rates" system, a per household aberration which we have basically returned to. The fault in implementation was mostrly down to individual councils, who jacked up their "take", blaming central government. Remember that the average amount was supposed to be about £180, but councils made that average £360 (I was charged over £400 in the first year, annd went to court over it). When the amount reduced, it was far more acceptable, and a good thing.
For why the council tax is a bad thing, see " Britain’s council tax burdens" (taxpayersalliance).
Poll tax favoured the rich? It was only one sort of tax. There were and are all sorts of other taxes which did not.
Quite. It is not.
ReflexAngle2023
Active Member
Either you have not understood or are just an apologist or beneficiary in some way for the existing inherently unfair local taxation system. This is based on the totally arbitrary idea that house size, which also means value, determines how much you should pay for your local services.
That's precisely what is wrong with it.
The fact this bizarre, archaic system of local taxation has not been replaced by something better years ago is shameful.
You really mean, he needs to used some of his unearned, unwarranted income on his teeth.
Astramax
Super Member
They resemble tombstones!
What was that then, the increase in the Sovereign Grant? You really ought to know what you're talking about, and remove this:
