Help / Advice on Bathroom Shower options

Discussion in 'Plumbers' Talk' started by circuitbender, Aug 22, 2019.

  1. circuitbender

    circuitbender Member

    Hi All.
    After some advice / options I have for a new shower.
    Currently I have an electric shower and am planning a refurb so am thinking of a different shower to get it up to modern looks.
    The shower cubicle is staying where it is . Behind that is the immersion heater, gravity fed from the CW tank in loft about 3.5 m from the floor of the bathroom.
    I like the idea of doing away with the electric shower and changing to a mixer shower with a big " fixed " shower head , the one where you have only the controls in the shower cubicle, ( I like the idea too of the type with a diverter tap for a retractable shower head that you can use like a non fixed head.

    My question is whether there would be enough pressure and flow rate of hot water from the immersion heater. I dont know what the pressure is to provide a bar figure sorry.

    if necessary, I would fit a pump on the hot water side to get flow rate up. I was looking at the salamander pump .... Is that what I could use one of these pumps for , as in , on the hot water feed ??

    Also , I can easily feed the HW supply to the mixer shower, so I was reckoning on 22mm straight to the mixer shower connection and then drop down to 15mm, if thats what the connection is ??

    However, the HW run from the immersion heater to shower connections is only 2 metres at most.

    also, The immersion heater is the one with an integral feed from the CH boiler ( y plan ) and more often than not, family members might say ( can I put the boost on ) so i call for hot water from the boiler to heat up the HW cylinder so its really hot, - having said that, am I right in thinking that ( assuming I go for a mixer shower ) I will DEFINATELY have to go for a thermostatically controlled mixer one ?? - it seems logical that I would have to , so that there would be no faffing about with adjustments all the time .

    Sorry for the very lengthy question but I wanted to provide as much detail as possible.

    re: the pump ? - am I right in thinking its " auto start " as soon as it detects pressure drop when a tap is opened ??

    Thanks
    Adrian
     
  2. terrymac

    terrymac Screwfix Select

    You would need a pump ,without it your pressure would be wholly insufficient .
    The hot and cold supplies should be balanced pressures ,so you pump both .
    A dedicated cold feed from the loft tank to the pump, and a dedicated hot feed ( via a special flange ) from the cylinder to the pump.
    Yes to a thermostatic mixer valve.
    Consideration needs to be given to the cold water storage tanks size and its ability to replenish ,to put it another way if the pump delivers 16 litres per minute ,a ten minute shower would use 160 litres which the cold tanks inlet has to provide ,if your with me.
    Yes to pump starts automatically when shower runs.
    The hot water in cylinder also has to be heated ,obviously, in sufficient volume for repeated showering. As an example if 5 people all want to shower one after the other ,there may not be enough hot water ,as you may be using it faster than it could be re heated.
     
  3. Heat

    Heat Screwfix Select

    Firstly there are 4 options for powerful showers -
    Combi boiler (if mains pressure & flow decent). Note that you can have a combi gas boiler still heating your hot cylinder, giving hot water to taps, but also use the hot from combi itself to one or more hot outlet, like your shower for good and 24/7 instant hot water.

    Unvented cylinder (if mains up to job). Simplifies everything but has to be installed by a G3 qualified plumber.

    All in one power shower. Basically a box on the wall similar to your electric shower, but uses both the hot and cold tanks fed supplies and has built in pump.

    Or last option, a separate twin pump.
    Stuart and Turner one of the very best pumps. You get positive head pumps that have flow switches that switch pump on when shower on if enough head of water from cold tank.
    Or negative head (also can be called Universal) pump that starts when an outlet is open regardless of head of water or pipework.

    To install a pump you need air free supply hot water - a Surrey or Warix flange fitted the top connection of cylinder for example, plus you need dedicated cold pipe from cold water tank, regulated hot water in hot cylinder etc.
    Really a job for a decent plumber and using all copper pipes
     
  4. circuitbender

    circuitbender Member

    Thank you Terrymac and Heat for your quick responses. All the info you have provided makes perfect sense in every respect.

    Weighing things up and that I don't have an on demand combi, I'm steering towards a powerful electric shower with a decent shower head because of the fact that the cw supply is there and power of course , and in the meantime I'll do some sums as regards to the demand on the HW cylinder re the replenishment of cold from header tank and subsequent heating up.

    Sorry guys, more questions and would appreciate your thoughts pls

    The cw pressure in bathroom is sufficient, to a degree as regards the electric shower as it is at the moment , don't know the pressure, but I do know that complaints from the kids are drops in flow rate / pressure when toilet flushes / washing machine on etc etc, so that's prob the most important issue I want to address, hence me thinking of a mixer shower etc.

    Questions.... Is there an electric shower ( not a power shower ) that has an integral pump to upgrade the rising cw feed so it's always the same pressure / flow rate, independant of any other taps , toilets etc in the house being turned on . If not, is there an external compensating device ( regulating valve ? Or whatever to overcome this.?

    .... Also, is there an electric powerful shower where the main unit can be fitted external to the shower cubicle... But the controls are IN the shower cubicle , therefore you end up with a pleasing shower cubicle , but without the big box, if that makes sense. Looking through the screwfix book, they show digital showers but I haven't researched those yet ( prob won't because of the cost )

    Thank you
    Adrian
     
  5. Heat

    Heat Screwfix Select

    Yes you can get power showers that have the control inside your shower cubicle, but the rest of shower in a box that can be installed elsewhere.
    Aqualisa Quartz power shower or Mira digital are some of the main brands. You can have surface mounted controls making install easy and without damaged to walls etc.
    I personally think they are overpriced and complex
     
  6. circuitbender

    circuitbender Member

    Thanks heat
     

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