Help! Stud wall in new kitchen.

Discussion in 'Kitchen Fitters' Talk' started by Danielle93, Sep 10, 2018.

  1. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    Go with the hanging rail as several of us have suggested

    Use say 5x70 screws and you wanna get these bang in centre of studs. So as mentioned, you can make a few holes in PB behind where cabs are gonna hang to locate studs. As chips said, once uv found 1, they ‘should’ be equally spaced along the wall, but not every chipie is as considerate as SF Chips !

    Pencil mark where studs are roughly then tap a nail through PB to confirm uv hit wood. You want to find where stud starts and where it finishes, so tap nail through PB every 10mm or so. Once uv found edges of stud, then mark centre, ready to fix rail to - avoid areas where there may be cables running/buried in wall

    Start the rail slightly set in from the inside edge of 1st cabinet and it finishes just inside the edge of the last cabinet

    All other cabinet sides will need notching to sit over rail. This obviously doesn’t show so no worries

    Use a long accurate level to set rail height and drive home beefy screws into stud centres. The cabinet brackets are superb for lining up cabinets and once you understand how they work, are a pleasure to use :)

    Screw each cabinet to the next for extra strength and perfect alignment

    Can either use ‘inter screws’ (metal ones, neater and plastic ones are rubbish) or wood screws of correct length :eek:

    Neat way is to screw behind where each hinge plate sits so screws become ‘invisible’

    Enjoy your kitchen, it’s gonna be great :D
    Allsorts and Danielle93 like this.
  2. Astramax

    Astramax Super Member

    That's called being prepared, you never know when visitors may call. :oops:
  3. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    Or an OCD hoarder.
  4. longboat

    longboat Screwfix Select

    Yep, I've been using them for ages too when fixing heavy things to studwork walls.
    Remember years back when me and my mate fitted a kitchen for his parents.
    His dad had the same concerns, "ya can't fit them on plasterboard" so us young-uns always knowing best, decided to teach an old dog some new tricks.
    The kitchen was out, clean slate. We fixed one of the old units a few inches off the floor with screw in plasterboard fixings and then sat on it.
    The unit stayed.
    Triumphant kids, and an old man eating humble pie.
    I weighed about 11stone back then, but that still equates to about 168 tins of baked beans or 70 average sized dinner plates.
    Try getting that lot in a 600 wall cabinet.

    Have been using them fixings ever since.
  5. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    There is a video where somebody tests all the various plasterboard fittings to destruction, I'm sure KIAB can find a link, and they were one of the strongest fixings.
    kitfit1 likes this.
  6. WillyEckerslike

    WillyEckerslike Screwfix Select

    A compromise might be in order Danielle. Use a hanging rail - well documented above - with screws straight into the studs and with the self drive fixings at regular intervals in between. I've hung loads of wall cabinets on stud walls using this method - no failures yet.

    An easy way to find the studs is with a magnet. Slide it around over the board until you pick out a plasterboard fixing (screw or nail). Once you've found one just check above and below if possible to check that you haven't picked up a random fixing into a noggin. Easier to do than describe.

    Good luck.
  7. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    You don't need both just one or the other.
  8. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Screwfix Select

    I remember some years ago watching probably the same video. As i remember it, the metal Drivas were tested to 35Kg each, so with 4 drivas to a wall cab that's 140Kg. If peeps are loading up a wall cab to 140Kg you have to ask why are they filling all there wall cabs with bricks and lead ingots :D
    The Fischer ones i linked to have got some justifiable criticism for the screw being difficult to screw into the driver, we have found the same thing over the last 3 months or so. A very easy way to get around that is a quick spray of silicon spray into the driver hole, the screw then goes in very easy.
    It's worth doing because the option of changing to the "Spit" drivers costs 50% more...............................and margins are still margins :D
  9. Allsorts

    Allsorts Super Member

    Hi Danielle.

    "DISASTER, my mum just told me you can't put wall units on a stud wall..." Stud walls are often easier to mount wall units on to, provided you do manage to catch a few studs, and they will be very strong and secure.

    How many wall units are there?

    Continuous rail is by far the best solution as mentioned before - if screwed securely in to the actual studs they will not fail. Also, once level, fitting the units on to them is a breeze.

    Who is fitting these units - you or a 'pro'? You'll notice that a notch has to be removed from the unit's side panels adjacent to each wall unit mounting to allow it to sit over this rail - except for the two very end panels.

    If you can manage to fit a rail, then you are ok and nothing else will be required.

    I would NEVER rely solely on ANY type of plasterboard fixing for such a job. They are perfectly good for many jobs, but not for anything that's (a) heavy and (b) will be subjected to shocks, knocks and movement; once even the slightest movement begins in any p'board fixing, it's going to weaken and ultimately fail - almost guaranteed.

    If you cannot use continuous rail because the studs don't fall within the unit run, then the next best solution would be to cut away a horizontal rectangle of p'board between the studs and securely screw horizontal noggins along there to suit the height of the mounting brackets. This might sound like a major task, but it isn't - measure and cut neatly using a Stanley knife or similar, remove p'board, fix noggins and then screw the p'board pieces neatly back in to place over the noggins; most of it will be covered by the units, but any visible joins will be easy to fill and sand.

    If you MUST use p'board fixings to hold up your units, then your own idea of a timber rail along the bottom for the units to sit on is actually a very good idea. This will not look an eyesore and will, in fact, barely be noticed unless you are (a) very short or (b) lying on the kitchen floor, in which case you have more pressing issues to deal with.

    This supportive rail would not only help support the weight of the units, but would also help prevent any movement in them - and you know what movement does...

    If you find - as is often the case - that a continuous rail won't hit more than 2 studs (bare minimum) or might even only catch one, then you should get away with a combination of a good fixing in to the stud coupled with then using p'board fixings to secure the rail in a few places. Hint: when it's all lined up and you are ready to fix that rail in to position, apply a bead of a really good adhesive such as StixAll all along the rail so's it ends up bonded to the wall surface. This will almost certainly stop any movement in its tracks, and that's half the job done.
    Danielle93 likes this.
  10. Danielle93

    Danielle93 Active Member

    Purchased my rail, thought I'd go about finding and marking the studs instead of twiddling my thumbs, corner one was easy, right next to the wall and the plaster over the top of the plasterborad had come away from a nail head. Second was, as said, 400mm across (got my smallest drill bit a put tiny holes either side to find the edges) then....nothing. I measured 400mm across again, drilled a little hole and it jist went straight through, went about 500mm either side and still nothing! Will have another bash tomorrow when I've not done a 15 hour work day. Here's hoping I find my vanishing stud!
  11. Danielle93

    Danielle93 Active Member

    There's a 600mm corner unit and two 500mm units. So (once I've found them) there should potentially be 4 studs to screw on to. I've ordered my rail as this seems the most logical way of going about it. Much better than a) cutting a big chunk out of the wall or b)fixing it to plaster board and crossing my fingers. There's a good thick layer of plaster over the top of the plaster board so I don't think a Stanley knife would cut it.
  12. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    Tap on the walls with you knuckle, it should sound hollow where there isn't a stud and more of a dull noise where there is.
  13. Allsorts

    Allsorts Super Member

    Sounds promising.

    There will always (well, should) be a stud in the corner to secure the end of the p'board. The next one out from there could vary in distance as the stud spacings could well have been started at the other end, say at a doorway.

    These spacings could be 400, 450, 500, 600 or similar to these in inches.

    So, happy searching - I hope you find your elusive stud. (Ooh-er, missues).

    If you manage to secure to 3 or 4 studs, you'll be absolutely fine.
  14. Richard_

    Richard_ Screwfix Select

    The joiner probably started from the other end of the wall at regular centres (to match the plasterboard sizes) and the end you started at is whatever was left to close the gap. Measure from the other end and you'll find your studs at a multiple of 400 or 600. Try 2400 or 1200 because they are a multiple of both ;)
    Danielle93 likes this.
  15. metrokitchens

    metrokitchens Screwfix Select

    or could be egg box stuff - real trouble then!
  16. Allsorts

    Allsorts Super Member

    Nah - it's as Richard said. Know how I know? 'Cos it's also wot I said :p
  17. Richard_

    Richard_ Screwfix Select

    Eh?!?! How did that happen? You are of course correct, and first to say it too.
  18. Allsorts

    Allsorts Super Member

    I'm lying here starkers, body covered in cream - you now need to lick it all off.

    did I type that out loud...
  19. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    Are you talking to me, are you talking to me?
    Allsorts likes this.
  20. Allsorts

    Allsorts Super Member

    Er, yes, of course... :rolleyes:

    Richard, PM me...

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