How to increase floor level

Discussion in 'Builders' Talk' started by Suzan Aydin, Dec 14, 2020.

  1. I-Man

    I-Man Screwfix Select

    stevie22 literally told you what to do, and yet you've just asked the same question anyway???

    "If your joists are solid leave them alone and pack them up.
    You say you're 95mm low? Your 2x4s will measure 95 so that fills the gap: either lay them along the joists or cross them. Crossing easier as you can make sure your centres are spot on to suit your boards. This really is a no brainer."
    RolandK likes this.
  2. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    Don’t worry I’m just being insecure and wanting reassurance too much!

    tbh we just went with 2x9s with the ledger as 2x6.

    hopefully we’ll live for now.....
  3. stevie22

    stevie22 Screwfix Select

    Exactly: quickest, cheapest (you say you have the 2x4), easiest, strongest. What's not to like?
  4. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    I did something naughty and just changed the 2x6 joists to 2x9 *prays for forgiveness...*
  5. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    I honestly think this thread is just to get your post count up higher for some inexplicable reason, every single person on here bar you has given you good advice on doing it the correct way, and good advice on salvaging what you've got. What mildly irritates me is that I gave you advice in a previous thread on how to go about fixing your joists to the wall and what fixings to use, and to keep them down from your threshold the flooring thickness, and fair play to you you ignored everything I and others advised and messed it up, now you're asking for help to sort out your mess, which we all have, and you're still debating the toss over the good advice you've been given as if it's a joke to you wasting people's time on here.
    RolandK, Red Star Boats and I-Man like this.
  6. Red Star Boats

    Red Star Boats Active Member

  7. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    Sorry I wasted your time. No, I’ve got better things to do than get my count up.

    peace out, have a good Xmas - hopefully you’ll be less irritated
  8. WillyEckerslike

    WillyEckerslike Screwfix Select

    Suzan you aren't going to have this wet room fully functional in seven days I'm afraid so you must think of an alternative plan now.
    If it's taken you three days to get the flooring joists in you're going to really struggle when it gets to the difficult stuff. Things can take longer than expected especially if you've not done it before - that's a fact not a criticism. Your deadline is oppressive, you'll get more and more tired and make more and more mistakes some of which won't be so easily reversible/correctable as this one.
    Be realistic and look at your options. There will be a way - there always is. Give yourself time to do a proper problem free job that you can be proud of and confident in.
    Good luck.
    Suzan Aydin and DIYDave. like this.
  9. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    thanks willy - appreciate it. We are meant to be moving house on the 21st, my MIL desperately needs a wet room as the council have said it’ll take a year... and I’ve been asking questions for my OH who is doing it, but obviously I’ve sometimes been repeating myself, or he hasn’t taken advice of some people (Jord) as some issues weren’t addressed (I’ve spoken to carpenters elsewhere who disagreed with him and said 2x4s should never be used, joists should always be drilled centre of brick), etc, and we screwed up with how high the joists were and taking them down was borderline impossible as the 18mm holes were so tight (why they say 16mm bolt with 18mm is beyond me as it just seems super tight) but we got it in anyway!

    to get them out we would have probably have to knock the bathroom down and yes, we were both exhausted from this.

    if anything, the next bit is quite simple. Stud wall, backer board, lay down chipboard 22m flooring, fit impey 22mm shower tray, tank, adhesive, tiles.

    the only challenging bit from all that is to layout the plumbing but even that isn’t too hard. We were hoping the floor was fine and there was no asbestos but both initially didn’t turn out to be true so we both were knackered when it came to the floor!

    we’ve both rested today, so onwards and upwards - won’t let the negativity of some on the forum bring me down. You’d think there would be some humility when someone is asking too much or repetitively. There’s usually a good reason I.e forgetfulness, exhaustion, I haven’t posted all the caveats, etc.

    whatever, life is too short and I appreciate all the good responses anyway :)
  10. I-Man

    I-Man Screwfix Select

    Fitting the joists should have been one of the easier parts of your bathroom job.... so don't underestimate the "Stud wall, backer board, lay down chipboard 22m flooring, fit impey 22mm shower tray, tank, adhesive, tiles" which you think is also going to be "simple". However long you think it'll take you...double it (at least)
    Suzan Aydin likes this.
  11. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    Yep true say... I shouldn't..... worse comes to absolute worse we'll either have to find someone to complete it if it's going to take ages (hopefully not), or just put the toilet in... that's the least we need....
  12. WillyEckerslike

    WillyEckerslike Screwfix Select

    Just so that we're clear Suzan the negativity you've received would appear to be of your own making.

    It isn't borne out of malice or hostility but simple frustration. Everyone who posts on here and contributes possible solutions does so for your benefit not theirs (and anyone who follows in need of the same advice) out of goodwill. Trust me it can be more than a little annoying to answer a question and then be asked how to correct the situation that has now arisen because you didn't follow said guidance. You must surely understand that as you have a mother in law!

    Occasionally it can actually take longer for us to describe to a layman in easy to understand terms how to do a job than it would for us to actually do it ourselves. This only adds to our frustrations I'm afraid when that hard work is ignored - we're not all super computer literate.

    @Jord86 gives great advice based on what he understands your situation to be and literally thousands of people will have benefited from his knowledge, experience and helpfulness over the time he has been a member (and long afterwards). Oh, he hasn't been hostile to you yet... He can turn out some fabulous put downs when motivated.

    Take it for what it is, free expert advice directly answering the questions you pose and consider your own use of the word humility.
    Hans_25 and Suzan Aydin like this.
  13. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    I understand what you’re saying Willy and it was my own fault for not being clear enough about the predicament and how the advice jord gave would not apply to our circumstance. The video I equally posted might have been clear either that the original joists were sitting on just a bit of slate.

    the concern I had is that, whilst he had advised to use 2x4s like it was done originally (which would have been fine, I was happy to take his advice), I spoke to other carpenters that said 2x4s should NEVER be used as floor joists.

    So yes, in that sense, I didn’t take his advice, and ended up with a lower floor due to having the joists lower because they were bigger and it was a worry to drill where jord said as if we drilled to level of the floor threshold we were either on mortar or not centre to the brick - we obviously screwed up when we had 2x6s but changed them to 2x9s and everything is ultimately fine now - sledge hammering and removing those 2x6 rim joists was good advice but time and cost were something we had to take into account.

    advice can only be taken if the situation allows it, and all aspects of the situation need to be addressed, I understand becoming frustrated but sometimes the OP like myself can’t explain everything issue with everything and it might be taken as advice not being heeded, that’s all I meant...

    my biggest concern was people from many forums and phone calls saying do NOT use 2x4s for a floor.

    imo I still don’t really understand why if it’s a small room with a small span but.... I’m an amateur who ultimately knows nothing about flooring.... the only thing I’m pretty good at is laying underlay and putting tongue and groove :eek::D
  14. stevie22

    stevie22 Screwfix Select

    Oh dear oh dear you ignore advice and you complain about negativity and want humility???

    Sorry lass but you've made a hash of the easy bit despite our best efforts and you expect the hard bit, where there is much more that can go wrong, to go swimmingly
    RolandK likes this.
  15. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    Anyway, this is a futile discussion. Thanks for your help.
  16. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    Btw, it wasn't a complaint, it was an observation.
  17. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    Did you mention to the other carpenters and other forum members that the span you were looking to bridge was about a metre and a half in length, which 4x2 is easily capable of spanning? Any carpenter that says point blank 4x2 aren't suitable for use of floor joists clearly hasn't worked on houses over fifty years old, and should really brush up on their skills before commenting.
    Jiml86 likes this.
  18. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    Thank you, I'm blushing. :oops:
    WillyEckerslike likes this.
  19. Suzan Aydin

    Suzan Aydin Member

    Seriously Jord86, I always said width 1.47m length 2.45m, and they ALWAYS said 2x4 should never be used REGARDLESS....

    Someone on the popular DIY StackExchange forum called "Isherwood" quoted the following:

    • 2x4s aren't appropriate as joists for anything larger than a stairway landing, and even then I'd use 2x6. Why is 2x4 your limit?
    And the reason he was asking why 2x4 was my limit is because I was following your advice initially... that's why things turned south really quickly....
  20. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    It's a shame he didn't offer an explanation as to his incorrect blunt comment rather than just come out with things, how does he think old houses were built with sleeper walls then, or your previous bathroom setup before you altered things, how does decking manage to bear the weight of people and parties in nice weather if the framework is 4x2, etc etc. Next time you ask advice, try asking for the reasoning behind the statement.

    It's irrelevant really because you could have used 2x2 or 10x2 hypothetically, the joists were positioned incorrectly regardless.

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