How to measure and build a new staircase...

Discussion in 'Carpenters' Talk' started by Halfaudio, Sep 28, 2020.

  1. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Grain what?:D I thought that was correct? The grain should have gone the other way is that what you are saying?

    Yes these are just tests, but i have to be honest i have done the tongue on two 3m riser i just need to cut it in lengths...

    The diameter on the tongue is good just the depth changed when the router was in the table like in picture but it has no springs because otherwise it would be to short..
    Router went up and made two treads went 2mm deeper, i could fix that but on the last one it went 5mm deeper not a chance i could fit that..

    One the rest it is a nice tight fit i don't have to bang it in, but i have to push it in with my hands slightly.

    This project was my first router experience and woodworking, it's safe to say i am miles out of my comfort zone and my knowledge about this ended where i started.

    Actually i had a bit of scary experience when the bit nearly flew out because i didn't lock it tight enough it started to wobble a bit and vibrate hard so i checked the router and yep it was almost out.. that was when i tried the parkside router first time on the nosing for the treads and then i just got the Trend one..and i prefer 1/2" bits instead of 1/4" So yes fist time users, don't make the same mistake i did...
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2020
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  2. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    Hiya, I am back home, will have more up for you in a couple of hours.
     
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  3. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    The lower wall string dims.

    This one should be long enough to cut the tenons on to the ends.
     
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  4. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    Opps forgot the attachments!!


    bottom wall string.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

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  5. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    Upper stringers.

    Here are the two upper stringers.

    I have drawn these showing the bottom of the stringer being curved to flow into the ceiling line, these can be straight and the ceiling to staircase soffit will just be mitred, I will add a couple of images later to show the difference.


    The top of the top wall stringer may also be curved to flow either into the skirting or stop dead and the skirting butt to it.
    Here is a page showing some of the options available for the stringer skirting transition.



    https://knostairs.com/staircase-glossary-visual/stair-stringer/stringer-skirting-transition/

    Top wall string dims.jpg top well string.jpg


    The next stage is routing the housings into the newel posts. For the top newel where it sits over the landing, I will need to know the size of the spindles you are going to use; as this will set the newel position for the landing fascia and top nosing.
     

    Attached Files:

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  6. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    I had no time to do any work on the staircase for the past two days. Looks like a late one tonight then..

    You have added a lot of pictures in your web page looks really professional.

    I have 24 spindles, more than enough...
    3.5x3.5
    89,5 long

    Newel posts are 9x9
     
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  7. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    Happy new year and all that, but the most important issue is..... How are you getting on, @Halfaudio? What's the escalator situation like now?
     
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  8. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Jord86 Yep happy new year, @Halfaudio I am all ready to get more drawings over if you are ready. well almost let me know and I will get some sorted.
     
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  9. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    @Jord86
    Happy new year, let's hope this year will be easier...
    Had my lazy moment, I was hoping santa might pull of a miracle and bring me a ready staircase :D

    I must admit the stringers scare me the most.

    When i have to glue them together do i sand the surface slightly or just glue them together and press nicely or hard?

    I bought biscuits and biscuit cutting bit, looks like it makes the alignment less painful right?

    I will start with the lower wall string
    Any other tips before i screw up?
     
  10. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    Use sash cramps, if you glue the strings together with Polyurethane glue then you don't actually need biscuits as by the time all the housings are routed out and all components fitted together the separate strings will be locked together and be bulletproof. When laying the strings out alternate the slight cupping in the timber, so one up one down etc.
     
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  11. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    When you say sand the face? the jointing or mating faces do not need sanding, they should be straight and a true 90ยบ to the stringer faces, which refer to the faces that you rebate the tread housing into and the opposite face that is seen from outside the staircase.

    When the stringers are glued together you may need to sand the faces a bit just to smooth them off before setting the jig down to router or else the housing may end up different depths. Any face that is not seen as it will be against the wall does not need the wall side face sanding.

    Using the biscuit jointer will make it very easy to keep the faces flush with each other. 1 biscuit about every 3-400 mm should be good.

    Glue: I would use PVA by choice, a lot less messy and eaiser to clean up than PU.

    Tip. before glueing up, lay out the stringers and get a rough idea of where the treads are going to sit this will allow you to position the biscuits so they do not show when you cut the tops of the stringers to get the curves. These rough marks can be sanded off before doing the final mark up for routing.

    I will get the other stringers drawn up tomorrow evening.

    P.S. Sorry to hear Santa's sack wasn't big enough, but he would have stolen your fun when he left the staircase.
     
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  12. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Question time.
    This is why i was scared of it..
    Do i use margin piece for the first winder stringer?
    How do i start this, it seems a bit odd the piece would end up very wide. Is there a certain angle i am looking for here to guide myself or am i just having a brain fart?
     
  13. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio




    Had to think through this a bit but hopefully, this makes sense, once you have done a few of these it all makes perfect sense, so you just have to buy a few more houses to practice on.

    1. Find some scrap material and using the pitch board, draw the rise and goings first, no need to worry about grain or anything else now. Once you have this you can draw the top and bottom of the stringer. (I will do a separate answer later to explain a bit about how to get the flow for these.)
    2. Cut around the rise and goings, this will help position the stringer on the stringer stuff.
    3. Lay out some of the stringer stuff.
    4. Lay the bottom half of the template onto the stringer stuff. You want to keep the boards as long as possible so try and align the template accordingly. On longer stringers that have straight treads running down and that you can use the margin piece on, you will keep the grain as you would in the straight sections. I will give you an indication too this as I draw each one up.
    5. Put the top bit of the template back in place to confirm you have enough room once the stringer stuff is glued up.
    6. Move the template to suit the minimal amount of stringer stuff required, leaving a bit of room for play.
    7. Glue the stringer stuff together.
    8. Draw round the template or put a couple of guide marks down and use the margin piece and straight edges to draw the rises, goings and ends of stringers onto the stringer stuff.

    Winder marking.jpg
     
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  14. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    Don't be scared of this, any questions you have I am more than happy to try and explain. I have all the time in the world for someone willing to learn and you are proceeding quite nicely with something that most carpenters have never done and many joiners would have been in the workshop for a couple of years before they build their first staircase.

    Much of this will make more sense once you have done it.
     
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  15. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Jord86

    Thought we'd best get this going again, your anxiety levels must have been peaking!! Better than waiting for the next episode of your favourite T.V. programme.
     
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  16. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select


    It's a bit subdued at the moment, I've got the popcorn ready for when Halfaudio routs the wrong side of the string or forgets the router offset, though I've faith in your teaching and his ability that it will turn out a happy ending.
     
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  17. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Member

    @Jord86
    I can imagine the excitement, you and others anxiously waiting next stage and more problems that appear from seems like nowhere and the challenges i have to overcome man i would be waiting for it as well.

    @SoManyUserNames
    I truly appreciate the time and effort you actually put in here i have no words for it, i never expected that when i signed up here.

    It makes more sense now. I was picturing something similar. I will give it a go and will post some pictures.
     
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  18. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    Not sure if this helps or not but have done a quick video, not great editing! let me know if you can view it or not.

     
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  19. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Amazing presentation Master Yoda! Thank you.
    I was having a one on one time with my boiler.. Cleaned out the a few bits it was stalling and had a drain collector and pipe blocked. Gas guys are reading and screaming now :rolleyes:
    I asked my kids to make something for me from paper in the mean time and after i came up with this.
    You can see what I was using to come up with a nice curves, I saw this on Youtube..
    I might need to adjust the the line in the left corner, looks like it is going up, but it needs to go straight at that point?
    I was using next rise height to find the right height for the line.
    [​IMG]
     
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  20. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    I might need to adjust the line in the left corner, looks like it is going up, but it needs to go straight at that point? Yes needs to be level.
    I was using next rise height to find the right height for the line.This is correct

    Everything else looks good, the curves are flowing nicely, they will obviously be a bit more curved to achieve horizontal at the ends.
     
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