How to measure and build a new staircase...

Discussion in 'Carpenters' Talk' started by Halfaudio, Sep 28, 2020.

  1. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Some pictures of me working..
    Made a quick router jig for the mortises
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    I have left 3cm extra on the long newel and you can see by the laser it is off by 3.1cm i would say that is that is pretty good.?
    All the other newels still need to be cut shorter, but i will do that once i will finish the routing.

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  2. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    Nice one, looking good.

    Jigs are always worth the bit of time they take to make, as we say jiggery-pokery matey.
     
    Halfaudio likes this.
  3. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Question time Master.

    Did I mess up really bad or just a bit?
    Red ??? marks do I need to route them out straight like the line is going or route out as usual?

    I need to rout out the other corner bit yes.
    The yellow box is another space for Mortise and Tenon, I will have to add a full width stringer around 40cm long ( good guess ) to finish it off in the half newel that is not included here.

    The ceiling line is that going to be a big visible issue ? I can't believe it didn't see it earlier... The line is approximately somewhere there..
    I might need to make a nice square and glue it nicely in and hope that nobody ever will notice it...

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    Little piece of wood in the middle acting as a stopper for easier routing..
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    Last edited: Mar 11, 2021
  4. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    This all looks good, the ceiling line bit should be covered by the bottom of the stringer, so nothing to worry about there.
    I will have a proper look shortly and get some more visuals up.
     
  5. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Ahoy there matey.
    The weather this week.. woke up and my workshop was flipped upside down, thankfully it is not the cheap one and I am still in the game.

    This is actually quite quick part, once you have done all the markings and just need to route out.
    A few more picks didn't had the chance to finish it as the hail and rain spoiled the fun..


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  6. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    I have done the 1,2,3 newel posts, but haven't done yet anything with the half newel post and the piece of wood that goes between the newel nr3 and half newel.
     
  7. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames

    Should I apply the same technique for this middle piece? Mortise and tenon just different depth like 3cm and smaller diameter dowels?

    I still need to cut off the 3 joists and get a new one for the end or I can use scaffold board that I have just cut it to the right width

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  8. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

  9. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member


    Hi Sorry for the lack of communication the last couple of weeks, I have been on-site, 16 hour days so collapsing when I get in.

    Yes you can make the trimmer returning to the main landing the same way, a smaller mortice will work.

    Yes a scaffold board will work, normally you would screw two together to give a double trimmer. this just gives extra strength and reduces any bounce that might otherwise be there.

    I am onsite again tomorrow but will get some instructions up on Saturday on how to dress the treads in for final fitting.
     
    Halfaudio likes this.
  10. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    I know you are busy, but i have been dragging this a bit now, would you be able to guide me the right direction at least with a few words. :)


    I have done all the things i could including wedges, but i need to get them things together now.


    Treads - sand the corners of for winders?
    How much? till the rise hits home in the wall stringer? And then cut the extra off from the back of the tread if any left..

    Rise - How to shape the sides?

    When do i screw the stringers together?

    I tried to put some of it together (dry obviously), but it didn't look right.

    How the heck do i level and square and where do i start and where do i finish...

    Do i assemble it on one side on ground and then try to flip it up? This seems a bit hard for one man i could get another hands ,but i can't ask for someone to help if i have no clear idea how to tackle this and even the the space is very limited.
     
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  11. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    Hi I am back, working 16 hours a day has worn me out, I finished the job today and will have a bit of time to go through this now.

    Treads - sand the corners of for winders?
    How much? till the rise hits home in the wall stringer? And then cut the extra off from the back of the tread if any left..
    I will draw up some guides for this.

    Rise - How to shape the sides?
    These will just be cut at the angle required, I will do visual guides for this.

    When do i screw the stringers together?
    The stringers are held together by the tread and riser wedges, no need for screws. the only place you will need screws is in the back of the treads through the risers.

    I tried to put some of it together (dry obviously), but it didn't look right.
    There is a final bit of dressing to do as they go together. this will be done along with dressing the winders in.

    How the heck do i level and square and where do i start and where do i finish...
    Lay the straight sections of stringer down flat and build the treads up in the stringers.

    Do i assemble it on one side on ground and then try to flip it up? This seems a bit hard for one man i could get another hands,but i can't ask for someone to help if i have no clear idea how to tackle this and even the the space is very limited.
    All the dressing in, pre fitting, full assembly but in sections can be done by one man, once this is done it will be time for the final glue up and installation, another hand would be an advantage for this stage as you will have to move the entire flight as one piece, you will have a full understanding of how everything goes by this time.

    I will get going on the last few instruction diagrams this evening but will more likely be tomorrow before I get them up here for you. I will get the bits that I can draw up quickly and that will keep you busy for the most amount of time.
    There is probably about 12 - 16 hours work left before installation.
     
    Halfaudio likes this.
  12. Donald Rhodes

    Donald Rhodes New Member

    making my own right now, what materials would everyone recommend?
     
  13. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @Donald Rhodes
    Start a new tread please, if you are want some pointers.

    @SoManyUserNames
    I thought I was working hard, you are killin it... Glad you have done the job, otherwise this ship is just a ghost wreck with out the captain.
    I was about to pack my bags, my misses is getting ready to book a single room for me in a hotel..

    Joking aside, I may have made a little error on one of the treads, nr10 to be exact..2mm shorter on the back..

    Should I start working on the handrail before it all goes together? Only then work on dressing in and pre fitting?

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    Last edited: Mar 29, 2021
    Donald Rhodes likes this.
  14. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    You can do the handrail first, this will allow you to mortice and tenon the handrail in also, this gives a lot more strength to the flight and helps keep any bounce out.

    Joking aside, I may have made a little error on one of the treads, nr10 to be exact..2mm shorter on the back..
    Entirely up to you it will only show at the very ends of the tread if the perfectionist in you is getting the better of you then go ahead but I would wait until you do the dressing in as it may not be as bad as you think.

    I have a lot of the stuff ready to do the next few bits just have to put it in a legable manner now.
     
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  15. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio
    The easiest way to get the handrail length is to place the handrail on top of the stringer and use a straight edge against the stringer shoulder lines to transfer the length for the handrail shoulder lines.


    handrail on stringer.jpg mark handrail.jpg
     
    Halfaudio likes this.
  16. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    The tenon is ideally about 40mm long, the haunch is about 10mm long and keep them just inside the handrail height to save the mortice showing through.

    handrail tenon.jpg
     
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  17. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames

    You mentioned perfectionist, I have a bit of issue with that, I tend to spend too much time on little details... I have heard that many times over the years.
    I did cut the treads to the right width today, now they fit like a glove.
    Proceeding to the handrail making now. Thanks for the illustrations.
     
  18. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio
    I have the same problem, I just consider that I am doing what should be done not that I am a perfectionist.

    I have added a quick video on dressing in the straight treads ready for glue up.



    I did forget to mention, once you have the first couple of treads in place, check for square, these normally square themselves as they are tapped home making sure the treads and risers are firmly in their rebates.

    Check for square.jpg
     
  19. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Thank you for the video!
    I am concerned about the winder treads and winder risers.
    Do I just sand of the tread end corners so it sits properly in the rebate?

    I see the way you mean that should help me, but this is how I imagined it going together.

    add first winder treads and risers
    add newel post
    add outer stringer
    add straight flight treads and risers
    add handrail
    add second winder treads
    add newel post
    add last treads in wall stringer
    add outer stringer
    add handrail
    add last newel post


    add piece of wood in-between the last newel post
    add handrail
    add half newel post (end piece)

    Not sure how the last piece will go together since the space is limited and I will have no wiggle room to get the last tenon and mortice to click together if you know what I mean.
    Would you recommend to clamp the straight flight together when the second assembly will be done?

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  20. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    I am just saving the drawings for this bit to help explain.
    I will get this up shortly and that will make the next stage a touch more obvious.
     
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