How to measure and build a new staircase...

Discussion in 'Carpenters' Talk' started by Halfaudio, Sep 28, 2020.

  1. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio
    O.K. just a small adjustment will get this sorted, I will do some images when I get back. Just have to run up to Chelsea and back, going on the bike so should be back by mid-day.
    The kites are always tricky to get in.
    Apart from that looking spot on. well done.
     
    Halfaudio likes this.
  2. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames

    Checked two times#
    Stringers are routed all Correct
    Newel posts all Correct

    I will check the rods, maybe I have made a mistake there.
     
  3. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    I will do some visuals but will take a couple of hours.

    The housing for the kite should wrap around the corner to allow the nosing in, so it is a simple adjustment. Just need to carry the housing a bit further, this will allow the tread so spin round and line up correctly with the wall strings. This was probably me not explaining properly.

    Here is a quick image from above just to show how it should sit, I will do a couple of images showing how the housing goes round the corner and the nosing sits in.

    kite round newel.jpg
     
  4. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames

    How it supposed to wrap around the newel i understand, but the tread hits home in the stringer after sanding the corner, but doesn't in the newel post.

    I have checked everything i have no clue what is wrong.
     
  5. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    Finally found it.
    The stringer has bowed incredibly I tried to make it straight, but it takes too much forse and i won't be able to apply it when I will be assembling it together.

    Can i adjust the two treads accordingly or this will affect the whole staircase and it is not a good idea?
     
  6. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    I have pulled in twisted and bowed strings by pilot drilling and screwing a couple of 2 1/2"-3" woodscrews through the back of the string into the tread that isn't sitting right, however it needs to be fixed to the newel housing first and sometimes dry wedged lightly to keep it in position from slipping.
     
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  7. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @Jord86
    That was something similar i had in mind. Looks like i will have to leave it till i take it inside and i won't be cutting anything now just in case it still ends up in the right place with couple of screws.

    Should i use large screws or bolts to bolt the inside stringers to the wall once done with it?
     
  8. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select

    Whatever you have to hand really, 100mm 6.0 woodscrews with brown plugs, frame fixings, thunderbolts, the stairs are self supporting once built so the fixings are only to stop movement or slight rotation of areas that aren't supported by a newel like the outermost corner of the winders.
     
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  9. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    It is unusual for the stringers to bow that much, especially as they should be pulled flat by the treads, risers, mortices and tenons. You can use screww through the sides of the stringers into the tread ends but normally the stringers will stay in place once wedged and glued. This is easy for me to say with a large number of clamps to pull stuff straight while glueing up, so by all means using screws allows you to keep bits in place while moving the clamps about to pull up the next section.

    you can adjust each tread separately and it should not make a difference to the rest of the flight.
    The kites are
     
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  10. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Looks like these are the last few steps.

    Yes i couldn't believe it either, but to be honest the boards were outside under a cover for half a year before the job really started and so many times they were in and out of the house, temperature changes and wood being wood..

    I only noticed this when i look at the staircase from a distance and when i looked at the tread nr4 i could see that it was not sitting straight compared to the straight flight (if that's how you call it)

    I have a plan to use the large clamps in sections. I have written down every step of the assembly on a paper just so i can visualise it.

    I was considering several approaches until decided to stay with one.

    There is a slight problem with the clamps i have no space to fit them behind i need at least 9cm behind the stringer to get the clam in. I tried to find a way around it, but i wouldn't be able to lift the staircase up or move it forward by the time i would need clamps.

    It was decided to knock a hole in the plasterboard and take one brick out in key points, 3 to be exact.

    Second option was to take apart the box that is in the way and just for the looks and lights seen in some pictures next to the staircase half newel.

    So if anyone has a smarter idea how to make this puzzle work in a way i can still assemble it and clamp it in the same time i am all ears..
     
  11. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    The final glue-up is always the hardest part of making stairs, it is ideally a 2 man operation for a flight of this size, you can glue up the main section and the first couple of treads, with the staircase lifted up and away from the back wall, then drop the flight down into place, your height is a good advantage for doing this but you will need another fairly fit person to take the bottom of the flight, and blocks that you can kick out of the way when you lift the flight to drop it into place.
    the part that needs the most effort is thinking the job through and it sounds like you are on that already.

    dead legs, car jacks, acro props anything that will help you support it and lower it into place will help.
     
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  12. Shytot

    Shytot Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames Your famous mate !!
    Just watched a video on YouTube and a great chippy Tony ( A&E building) was waxing lyrical about you .Respect :)
     
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  13. Jord86

    Jord86 Screwfix Select


    In the last year or two the amount of really good British woodworkers who've made great videos has multiplied tenfold, loads of great content out there now, not least of all this thread, a cracker.
     
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  14. Shytot

    Shytot Active Member

    I agree, I follow some great American finish carpenters on YouTube/ Insta but your right the likes of Robin Clevitt, A&E builders , Peter Parfitt from our own country are equally great .
     
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  15. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    Thank you.
    It is always a pleasure when your work is appreciated. probably more like infamous but I'll go with famous if I can get away with it.
     
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  16. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames

    Had to deal with 2 stringers that look like this...
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Had to make 3 screw holes unfortunately for the clamp to get the wonky stringer straight I will find a really close looking filler and just fill them in, easier than breaking the wall.
    The last step is in and a few risers as well just haven't made any pictures yet.

    How did we managed to click them all together? with no space for any movement as you can see the end newel sits right at the wall it was verrrry frustrating the only thing I had to cut shorter was the tenon for the end newel, but only 1 cm and it still was jammed in perfectly, but after a lot of wiggling, bending pushing and tilting we somehow got it together... Now what? Take the last pieces apart because it was only a control? dry fit. It was even harder with glue... Had to sacrifice the box for lights seen in a few pictures for now just so we can get it all together.

    I can still lift the staircase and move it in final place, but it is heavy and this required two fit guys to finish no way I could have multitasked and


    1)Any tips on balusters?
    2)How do I get them spaced evenly and still maintain the 9.9 cm (maximum allowed) or smaller spacing?
    3)Do I just cut and use spacers to separate and hold the balusters or is there another carpenters trick here?
    4)Do I need to glue or nail the balusters or just the spacers?
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2021
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  17. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio
    Thought it might be a bit heavy for a one man job but almost there, making the bits is easier than putting the jigsaw together.
    The stringers certainly have moved a bit.



    1)Any tips on balusters? Put some in!!
    2)How do I get them spaced evenly and still maintain the 9.9 cm (maximum allowed) or smaller spacing?
    Measure in a straight line between the posts.
    Add on one spindles width, this will make it easier as you are working with an equal number of spaces and spindles.
    Divide the length by 100mm plus the spindle width, this will give you the minimum amount of spindles required E.G. (978 + 44) ÷ (100 + 44) = 1022 ÷ 144 = 7.1
    Now round up the fraction to a full number, therefore 8.
    Divide the length plus one spindle by 7. So 1022 ÷ 8 = 127.75
    Once I have this I will normally mark this on the side of the stringer and transfer it vertically up to the top of the stringer, this will allow you to change from horizontal distance to pitch distance, making it easier to multiply up and mark each of the spindle positions.



    Spindle spacing plan.jpg spindles at pitch.jpg

    3)Do I just cut and use spacers to separate and hold the balusters or is there another carpenters trick here?


    4)Do I need to glue or nail the balusters or just the spacers?
    I would glue and pin the top and bottom of the spindles and just glue the spacers pieces.

    Bet you're looking forward to this bit. the fun bit after the hard work is done.
     
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  18. Halfaudio

    Halfaudio Active Member

    @SoManyUserNames
    Will put some pictures up when done with the ballusters or more questions..

    How long and thick screws do i use to secure risers to the treads? I did some pilot holes and done a few of them with 50 mm long screws should i carry the same way or should i reduce them to shorter length?

    I don't glue the tread to the riser right?

    Yes really looking forward to the finishing touches..
     
  19. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

     
  20. SoManyUserNames

    SoManyUserNames Active Member

    @Halfaudio

    opps forgot, glue the back of the tread to the riser.

    Also glue and pin the glue blocks.
     

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