Kitchen Tiling on Wooden Timber Floors

Discussion in 'Tilers' Talk' started by tilehelpneeded, Oct 1, 2005.

  1. problem

    problem New Member

    Thanks for the prices tileneeded, what did you pay for the aquapanel etc?
    Cheers again

    Passy
     
  2. tilehelpneeded

    tilehelpneeded New Member

    Hi Passy

    Wickes charge 11.98 for the Aquapanel. It's on a special right now. I think it was buy 4 get 1 free or buy 5 get 1 free. Anyway if you need it may be worth stocking up.
     
  3. tilehelpneeded

    tilehelpneeded New Member

    Hi Mudster / Bstyle

    Tile is natural stone / Limestone I believe or do you call it Travertine? Anyway it is natural and we sealed it with Lithofin Stainstop I think after we have finished laying it before.

    The one thing that is different is that there is a c. 15mm levelling difference from one end of my hall to the other. So whilst the adhesive is I guess few mm. thick at one end it is c. 15mm think at the other above the DITRA matting which is the end where there are numerous 1 or 2mm cracks in the adhesive although I have not lifted any tile to check the other sections.

    Despite this even at the good end where the tile appears to have taken well the grout lines are cracking. This is c. 1 year after it was layed. Also the problems start in the middle of the hall where the joists change direction as well.

    I honestly can not remember if the heater was left for 28 days before been used. The Warmup brochure says to leave it for 7 days according to their instructions. The problem I find is that each company always says something different.

    Does this help?
     
  4. problem

    problem New Member

    thanks very much tilehelp

    Passy
     
  5. ok....

    Stone needs far more reinforcement than equivalent porcelain or ceramics.

    By the sounds of it, the original floorboards are not ideal, but it would be a right nuisance trying to replace the boards back to joists in a hallway.

    I'd have tied the boards together using 9mm ply and gripfill or similar, screwing every 200mm.

    Glue and screw Aquapanel over this, using the aquapanel screws which will go through the ply and into the floorboards.

    Fit the underfloor heating and then tile straight on top.

    91215 = 36mm height overall, about the same as you have now.

    It's the adhesive manufactureres that insist on the 28 day period, although X7 dries in 24 hrs, it takes 28 days to cure and gain it's full strength, hence the wait.

    Sorry, but you need to pull it up and start again, you'll continue to have issues with any form of repair as the structure of the substrate is causing the failure.

    I also don't understand how the Ditra matting could help in this installation, I'd be delighted if someone could enlighten me on what it's actually is doing.

    Oh and Limestone and travertine are differnt, although fundamentally made up of calcium carbonate, limestone is a sedimentary rock and in most forms is quite uniform in structure and appearance.

    Travertine is formed around hot springs from the very same sediment as limestone, but is often found to be aerated and holed. To over come this the stone is filled and honed with a cement/resin mix.

    I could bore you with more detailled geological claptrap, but the above really expalins the difference in far cleaer terms.

    An marble is limestone that has been heated and compressed even further and has actually crystalised, hence it is usually more dense and therefore takes a polish better.
     
  6. Please excuse my appalling typing, I really should use the spell checker but keep forgetting.
     
  7. tilehelpneeded

    tilehelpneeded New Member

    Hi Mudster

    Thanks for reply. No problem with the typing mine is as bad!

    For the Warmup Wires in the Kitchen on the Cement Aquapanel. DO you need to use their green primer stuff. In the instructions it says no if you use an Insulated Tile Backer Board but Aquapanel is not insulated so I assume yes!

    Re: The hall. What's the best way to pull the tile up and do you know of any way to save the heating wires or am I looking at another £500 for new wire? I am sure we will break a tile or 2 and I only have a few spare so I will have to see if I can still get new tile or I am stuffed! i.e. Have to buy new tile also.

    PS. The grout lines were only 1-2mm wide if that makes a difference.
     
  8. Hi Mudster

    Thanks for reply. No problem with the typing mine is
    as bad!

    For the Warmup Wires in the Kitchen on the Cement
    Aquapanel. DO you need to use their green primer
    stuff. In the instructions it says no if you use an
    Insulated Tile Backer Board but Aquapanel is not
    insulated so I assume yes!

    Actually I'm not sure, I'd guess no as it seems unnecessary on any form of tile backer, but a quick call to them might settle your mind.


    Re: The hall. What's the best way to pull the tile up
    and do you know of any way to save the heating wires
    or am I looking at another £500 for new wire? I am
    sure we will break a tile or 2 and I only have a few
    spare so I will have to see if I can still get new
    tile or I am stuffed! i.e. Have to buy new tile
    also.

    Sorry there just isn't a trick to this unless your lucky. You are going to loose a fair few, and probably the same with the wire, I'd assume I was losing most of it.


    PS. The grout lines were only 1-2mm wide if that
    makes a difference.

    I'd want a minimum 3mm, unless it was grind in place flooring, but that's a whole new conversation and far more money!
     
  9. tilehelpneeded

    tilehelpneeded New Member

    Hey all,

    I want to thank all who gave me advice during our Kitchen Renovation project. We finished before Christmas and it looks great.

    The 18mm Plywood, 12mm Aquapanel and BAL adhesives/grout appears to have done the job and teh additional Noggins and 18mm Ply has really streangthened the floor. It sounds so much more solid than the hallway. Looks like we will be rippring up the hall and doing similar later this year when funds permit.

    When I get a moment I'll have to take pics!
     
  10. Polite to take the time to post a follow up, it's nice to know our advice is put to good use.
     
  11. bathstyle

    bathstyle Active Member

    Yep, nice to see a thank you, it makes this job worthwhile.

    By the way, have you had your wages yet Mudster? Mine are late again. Screwfix payroll system is getting worse ;)
     
  12. I was assuming the CHristmas break had slowed down the BACS transfer.

    I'll be organising indutrial action if the problem isn't rectified!
     

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