Male worktop joints without jig pegs

Discussion in 'Kitchen Fitters' Talk' started by Richard_, Sep 2, 2018.

  1. Richard_

    Richard_ Active Member

    I've started using a 10mm joint which gives a nice precise joint, after you've converted you'll see bigger joints as rather agricultural.

    The downside is that cutting the male without pegs is much harder. There's no 45 degree line, the hockey stick feeds into a tight radius that feeds into the edge of the bullnose. So it's a curve on plan overlapping the bullnose curve and you have to line them up. They don't touch so you're squinting from above trying to look straight down to check. The jig edge is also chamfered to complicate matters!

    So the question is, what's the best way to line the jig up with the scribed line on the bullnose on a narrow joint?

    Confession - As a result I'm back to using one peg on the male for reassurance.
  2. barbaricduck

    barbaricduck Member

    I agree a 10mm joint looks nicer, especially with square edged tops. You could fashion a datum block to assist I suppose, but I'm not getting why you don't just use the pegs? To me it makes no sense not to use them when you may be risking knacking a £150 worktop not to mention the extra time spent if you need to get a new one.
    Am I missing something here? !!
  3. Richard_

    Richard_ Active Member

    I use the method of using pegs for the female, lay the male on top, reach under and scribe the line on the underside of the male. Then flip over and align the jig with the pencil line.

    I usually set the jig square with pins and then nudge it a mm or so off square to match the line. Either the cabinets aren't square or the female isn't square or a bit of both. Using a single peg is an approximation and usually OK. I'm thinking the tight radius of the 10mm mitre will be less forgiving.

    As an example, the recent job is a small galley kitchen knocked through to the adjacent back room in an old house. The long run along the outside wall has a kink of 15mm where the two rooms joined. The side wall has a kink where the old plaster fell off removing the old tiles, except a metre length with 1 inch plaster that wasn't tiled because it was behind an old cupboard. I can't rip that down because it's got the incoming main supply and consumer unit.

    So I either get a plasterer in to line up the walls or simply loose it with a scribed off-square worktop.
    ajohn likes this.
  4. barbaricduck

    barbaricduck Member

    Yeah I scribe it too mate, but then still use the pegs. If the walls are not quite 90° then I usually nudge along the jig on both cuts by as much as needed (colorfil does the rest!!)..
    With the male cuts the pegs take the depth of the top into account, and you want that aspect spot on otherwise the front curved section of the mitre will be off. The longer straight scribed pencil line is generally less important as there is usually some leeway left to right, but the pegs do help in getting that initial curved section spot on.
    I don't necessarily think the 10mm inset is less forgiving on out of square joints, and I've not had any issues with them so far. I find the 10mm probably better to joint than the bigger traditional inset depth.

    I did try to upload a piccy of my last 10mm mitre which was a little bit off 90° but the file is too big. It looks and feels spot on mate
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2018
  5. metrokitchens

    metrokitchens Well-Known Member

    I use smaller mitres on square edge tops. Just slip a bit of 18mm board between the worktop and front pin. I only ever use one pin on the front of the jig and align the end to suit.
  6. Richard_

    Richard_ Active Member

    This morning I recut the male that was bothering me over the weekend. Fortunately I'd decided not to glue it on Friday!

    I had 2 goes taking a couple of mm off each time - it is already cut to length and the sink & hob are cut out so no room for big cuts. Each one was better than the previous.

    I think having to be precise about shaving off a couple of mm focused my mind. I think I simply hadn't got used to the new jig.

    The key was to use a 10mm pack to measure the offest from the scribe to the cutting face of the jig. This took out any quirks with the chamfered edge of the jig, and that seemed to sort out the accuracy.

    As ever the colour fil all squeezed out thanks to the perfect fit... except at the bull nose where the mitres are maybe half mm out, just enough to see the black backing on the pale faced laminate. Probably the female but I wasn't going to skim that. So a daub of colour fil rather like sealing a corner with silicon and it looks perfect.

    I know many fitters ask why bother with colour fill if it all squeezes out but I view it as an emergency back up or insurance if there is a defect.
  7. CGN

    CGN Well-Known Member

    Good tip metro :)
  8. Scott Green

    Scott Green Member

    What jig are you using? I use unika from ts and it has 23mm cut and 10mm cut set pin holes
  9. metrokitchens

    metrokitchens Well-Known Member

    My old first jig I traced from a mates solid metal jig !!! back in 1991. It was made from a bit of double sided laminated ply and lasted years. That had a 25mm cut.

    My current jig is the screw fix 900mm one that has a 35mm cut so the mitres always looks deep compared to what I learned myself on.

    Been doing it so long I tend to line the joints up pretty much by eye and a couple of pencil marks.

    The worktops are often so pants a bit of colourful is required on the front nose. If you ever do a straight joint good luck trying to match up the profiles - unbelievable how different two tops can be.
    CGN and Jord86 like this.
  10. Richard_

    Richard_ Active Member

    I've got the Unika jig. Just couldn't get my eye in.

    Using the 10mm packer as a scribe was perfect, it sits square against the jig so the edge chamfer on the jig was no longer an issue. It's so much easier to line up the sharp corner of the pack on the scribe line.

    I'll post a pic tomorrow
  11. L500

    L500 New Member

    Hi sorry if being thick but how do you use a 10mm packer I'm struggling with the 10mm joint also
  12. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Well-Known Member

    Give us a link to the jig you actually using...............or the make and model number.
  13. ajohn

    ajohn Active Member

    I like Richard's idea for marking out the male. I've never done a worktop before and it sounds more solid than trying too transfer from markings on the top.

    It would be easy to use the pegs and reduce the rad depth - just use a strip of something to pack the jig out as required.

    The video I watched that made sense but transferred marking from top to bottom for the male marked the width of the worktop for the female and used that to position the rad in the jig. That should make the 2 match apart from when the walls are out of square - that changes the width of the work surface as far as the jig is concerned.

    To be honest I don't see how the rad helps at all when walls are out of square and the pegs could ensure a **** fit if they are significantly out. The end of the piece forming an L that has the female in it might need scribing to match the wall it's up against ;) more complications.


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