Metric is an Imperial Nightmare - No Standard in sheet sizes FML

Discussion in 'Carpenters' Talk' started by FIXMAKEBUILD, Sep 9, 2020.

  1. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    Just ordered these as screwfix dont have them for delivery, got them on prime delivery for tomorrow, will save a few hours of driving tonight anyway :) thanks for the push to get them instead of using the bright nails.
    upload_2020-9-11_8-41-45.png
     
  2. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    I am kinda concerned with splitting the framing timber, i remember my grandad telling me to blunt the end of the nail and it will stop the chance of splitting the timber, i did consider screwing the whole thing but i read somewhere that nails have better shear strength unless you use a construction grade screw? im over thinking this right? its my way sadly.
     
  3. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    This is total build cost so far. Yes im one those guys that makes a spreadsheet for everything lol. like i said not tradesman but button pusher.

    upload_2020-9-11_8-49-36.png
     
  4. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    Thought i may as well post a pic of the tools i have purchased so far as well while im at it :)
    upload_2020-9-11_8-53-19.png
     
  5. Mr Rusty

    Mr Rusty Screwfix Select

    If you are using trusses, when they are delivered they will probably me marked up to show which way round they were made on the jig. Of course, they should be absolutely perfectly equal both sides, but in reality may be a smidgen different/handed. Order them with bigger eaves overhangs than you need and then trim back once installed - you can cut to a string line for an absolutely straight fascia. You talk about a "drip edge" but the ends of the trusses really force you to use a fascia.

    If you have a front/rear overhang you can extend your wallplate to support the end truss if it is outside the end wall.

    This is absolutely correct, and in many places screws are not allowed for structural timbers unless they are to a high specification. Nails are ductile and accommodate expansion and contraction through humidity and temperature better. Screws are harder and more brittle and can snap as they have lower shear strength/mm.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2020
  6. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    Thanks for confirming that, i will be mindful of the facia height, when i draw the trusses on the building later i will post another pic so you can see if im missing something, i have 2weeks off pushing buttons to complete this project and im going to be working by myself for most of the time, my lads work really hard so they can only help on sundays which isnt ideal, i have great neighbour across the street so hopefully i can call on him to help me lift the walls. otherwise the crazy one i married will have to get her hands dirty lol which im sure she will if needed, but being only 160cm tall or 5'4 for you imperialists she doesnt really have the strength for heavy lifting. just have to macguiver some kinda lifting pully system to help
     
  7. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    Heres a pic of the base and block after it was finished. he still has some tidying up to to do but its done at least
    upload_2020-9-11_9-8-22.png
     
  8. Mr Rusty

    Mr Rusty Screwfix Select

    You say it's a "workshop" - is it not having any windows for some natural light?
     
    WillyEckerslike likes this.
  9. Mr Rusty

    Mr Rusty Screwfix Select

    :eek: Please tell me you have planning permission. You're over 30sqm and <1m to boundary so you are going to come under building regs as well. Don't want to rain on your parade, but in the front, as that obviously is, it's not exactly hidden.
     
  10. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    I didnt plan to have windows at all, but im constantly changing my mind, to be honest no i havent applied for planning but i am taking pictures of everything and making sure i follow the rules i can find out. i was unsure if i needed it to be frank, My neighbours are all great, living in a small community everyone knows everyone and i have spoken to anybody near that might object and explained what i am doing. I can apply for planning retrospectively if there is a problem, its just a garage, there are other garages around me close to the boundaries so i dont really see a problem getting it if needed. Ok let me have it im sure i will get ripped for the above :(
     
  11. Mr Rusty

    Mr Rusty Screwfix Select

    People have a misconception about planning and Building Regs that it is based on "opinion" and people "not objecting". Unfortunately it isn't like that. There are both guidelines and rules. I won't go into them all, but building in front of the building line, over specified heights, within distances from boundaries, construction materials etc. are all factors. The planners don't do this by "opinion"; they look at the rules and regs and see if the building complies. It's a straight yes it does/ no it doesn't. Before you spend any more time and money, I do suggest you read up on both permitted development and planning so at least you understand the risk you may be taking. Sorry, you probably didn't want to hear that, but better at this end of the project than t'other.
     
  12. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    Thanks you're right i didnt want to hear it but i appreciate your take on it, i will look into it further. just on what you have said i am now worrying that it definitely doesn't meet the regulations of what you can build within the rules. should i just stop now and apply for planning do you think? im not sure i have the will to go through a lengthy application for such things. To be brutally honest, if i get any problems and have to take it down im gonna but an ugly 40ft shipping container there and paint it a hideous colour im joking of course. I know the building is close to the street but it will certainly meet any requirements for building close to a boundary, its about 1m back from the front of my house and a good 40m back from the main road, that road going down the side is a cul-de-sac with old age bungalows, i live on a corner house the pavement infront of my boundary wall front garden is about 15m and then the pavement about 4meters then the road the front garden is quite large, and the main road going down the front is a good 40m away.
     
  13. Richard_

    Richard_ Active Member

    Admittedly the sizes were determined by victorian technology and first codified in the Dorman Long catalogues in 1887.

    There are true metric sizes now that we we have the technology to keep the outer rollers in the same place with flange thickness varied by moving the inner rollers. Hence a 100x200 RHS or PFC will always be those dimensions.
     
  14. Mr Rusty

    Mr Rusty Screwfix Select

    I'm not a planning expert by any means, only know what I learned getting my own garage PP. There is a specialist forum over at https://www.diynot.com/diy/forums/building-regs-planning/ with some specialists, including a guy who is an active Building Control Officer. You can do a fair bit under permitted development, but you appear to have at least three challenges as to why this is not permitted development. 1) you are over 2.5m <2m from a boundary, (planning) 2) you are not primarily constructed from non-combustible materials and <1m from a boundary (BR), 3) you are over 30sqm which means the building is subject to building regs throughout.

    Keeping within regs probably does not mean that you can't have a garage in that position if you are a corner plot, but I really would research the rules and see if you want to modify your plans to keep within them. The pad/raft is good. It seems to me the only work at risk at the moment is the blockwork which you may in the end decide to modify to get below 30sqm (internal)

    A planning application is straightforward, and the drawings you have done will easily transpose into the plan and elevation you need. It costs about £250. The site and location plan you can download from t'internet and I expect your local council has the links. It's dead easy, but does take about 8 weeks. Obviously your risk if you do it without, but personally I wouldn't be spending thick end of £10K at risk....
     
  15. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    Thanks mate, i appreciate your input on this, urgh 8 weeks huh dam it, i am amending my drawing again as the building is 100mm over the 4m height allowance which is a strict regulation so im gonna bring the walls down 150mm which will still give me an 8ft ceiling height, The total internal area is 39.7m2 not sure how i would lose 9.7m2 in the footprint unless i redo some walls :( omg this is a nightmare now.
     
  16. Richard_

    Richard_ Active Member

    You really need to get planning permission and building regs approval.

    It is very easy, just download the forms from the council website. Your drawings have enough detail. Also have a look at previous applications so you can see what is needed.

    Finally, do give the council a call, most of the planning departments are very helpful because if they help you do it properly then they get an easier job.
     
  17. Mr Rusty

    Mr Rusty Screwfix Select

    No, think positive - it's still a learning curve :). You are saving £££ doing it yourself. Every day is a challenge. If you pull the side wall in, it's only a couple of rows of blocks (and now you've seen it done, you could DIY). This could, by making a bit narrower, get you below 30sqm and get you >1m away from the boundary so you don't have the combustible materials issue, and you should then avoid BR altogether. Remember planning is only really interested in use, location and appearance, so they want to know it will be, say, brown with a black roof and not red with a pink roof.

    BTW you really DO want to get below 30sqm otherwise you are liable to the full gamut of building regs - foundation depths, materials, etc.

    Although you say the neighbours are "onside" to your face, they may still "object" when given the opportunity to respond to the notice anonymously. I know! Fortunately, the rules ARE on your side, so as long as you keep within them the neighbours can object all they like, but it counts for nowt.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2020
  18. FIXMAKEBUILD

    FIXMAKEBUILD Member

    should have gone with something smaller :( gonna go have a meltdown for a bit. The thing is for 20years that piece of land has been really ugly, stupid yellow stone and a pad to fit a large caravan and stupid feather edge fence around. the north face of my house is hideous because of green algae so the new build certainly make it look pretty from the street as its always bugged the hell out of me. I wanted to use composite siding which will be nice and those arent combustible, along with the rockwool which isnt either, so really its only the framing and osb thats the issue and the fact that its only 300mm from the boundary thats the real issue?
     
  19. WillyEckerslike

    WillyEckerslike Screwfix Select

    There's one on here as well. Could be the same person... Knowledgeable and helpful whoever it is.
     
  20. Mr Rusty

    Mr Rusty Screwfix Select

    Y fruttbun - think it's the same guy.

    Personally, I think the composite cladding will make the walls BR compliant for fire. A "traditional" block and tile/slate building is considered not combustible even though it has timber trusses etc. If you can get it <30sqm and >1m from boundary it doesn't matter anyway - it could be all timber then - if you can do that, the roof covering you have chosen is OK too.

    FWIW my garage work in progress is 3.3m x 8.6 internal which is just under 30sqm and it's big enough!
     

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