need advice on kitchen worktop

Discussion in 'Carpenters' Talk' started by sarah martin, Jul 2, 2014.

  1. snezza30

    snezza30 Member

    I agree !

    The Fitters should stand the cost of ALL materials AND labour, but from what you have said Sarah, I doubt they will be willing to do either. Having paid in full, and still not being happy with the job, doesn't leave you with many options.

  2. She almost certainly could force them - or sue them for the cost of someone else to do it. There are a number of issues at fault here - cosmetic (door architrave), practical/ergonomic (reaching under for the door handles) and one which will undoubtedly affect the life of the worktop (the join near the sink).

    That's quite enough. Coupled with the fact that they must have known about all three - and yet didn't consult the client who was back and forth all day.

    The 'forcing them to sort it all' route will be a bit of a 'mare, but it's Sarah's call.
  3. goldenboy

    goldenboy Super Member

    There is a clearly been a bit of a problem with the planning out of the joints on this.

    Responsibility might lie with a combination of everyone. The designer who designed it, whoever ordered the tops plus of course the fitters

    Certainly the joint under the sink WILL fail.

    I have been very close joints to sinks and hobs before but never have I had to cut into one. And I wouldnt.

    Also not sure how well the plywood screwed to the walls in the sink photo will take tiles.
  4. sarah martin

    sarah martin New Member

    thank you all so much for your thoughts,ideas,comments etc.i was hoping at this stage I may have an update on the situation but no luck I,m afraid. the only thing that they have agreed to do is to come back & put a rounded end on the b/b which was 1 thing I wanted & maybe it will improve the look of the "cupboard" side slightly- they say that the fitting & appearance is quite acceptable (to them) I of course disagree-yes I could go down the route of getting someone else to re-do the surfaces,pay the price & then pass the cost onto them-no doubt I would win but apart from it being a lengthy process (where by I am still out of pocket) it is 1 thing a court agreeing with me & ordering them to pay but it,s quite another getting the money out of them-I think all things taken into account it looks like the join on the surface is going to cause a problem in the near future so I intend to start saving again,keep my eyes open for some good deals on work surfaces & when the time comes have the whole lot renewed - I have learned so much from this experience & now know more of what I am talking about & looking for - i do know next time i will be watching like a hawk !! lol - just to reiterate how all this has happened-firstly i had a "kitchen designer" draw up plans,these were e-mailed to a large well know kitchen suppliers who priced it all up,only fault there was they failed to say that they couldn,t supply a 900 b/b (as on the plan) but just sent a 952-i paid & all was delivered-the fitters then came (they were nothing to do with the kitchen company) they had seen the plans beforehand & the rest is history - i will put an update on here if/when they come back or there is anymore news - thankyou all again so much for your help.
  5. goldenboy

    goldenboy Super Member

    No problem Sarah. I agree its very difficult to pin things down when lots of people. Firm A blames Firm B who blame Firm C etc etc.

    My advice would be just live with it for the moment. In the future do a change Worktop swaps are pretty simple affairs. I would be tempted as you have some layout issues to go down the route of solid timber as you can shape and joint much more creatively. Not as expensive as you may think.

    Two bits of advice. Use resources like this and similar such as Stanleytools forum and trade specific ones to get advice and check whats happening when works being done. Secondly if you get your bathroom done for example get a local firm to supply and fit the lot. Saves a lot of hassle.
  6. It has to be your call, Sarah, but they are taking advantage of this simple fact you've paid them.

    I'd have thought at least that they should (a) move that end unit forwards so that you don't have to reach under to grab the handle (that's just crazy...) and (b) offer a proper warranty on that worktop joint that goes under the sink. For (a), the main issue for me is not the cosmetic one, but the ergonomic.

    These two things are really, really basic errors. No kitchen anywhere should be like that. The worktop eating into the door architrave is largely, I think, a 'cosmetic' issue and one that can be accepted as a 'solution' if ,say, it enables an install to proceed - even then, it's your call. But the other two things are really fundamental mistakes.

    Who's fault is this? Certainly not yours; you employed professionals for both aspects of the job. It would be interesting to see the plan drawn up by this kitchen designer; that should highlight any culpability from him. But it is certainly the kitchen fitter's fault from that point on in that they should have stopped as soon as they realised what was going to happen.

    There are a few joiners and actual kitchen fitters on this forum; I, myself, used to fit them a few decades ago, and still fit my own now. That join under the sinktop?! No, never, ever. It is wrong on two counts; one, it's very weak as only a couple of inches of worktop at the back and the same at the front is actually 'joining', and two because that visible joint line you see will suck in any water that lands there by capillary action. If it doesn't start to do this right away, then it almost certainly will within a year. Your worktop will swell along there, and will in short time after be ruined.

    Your call. And it's a really difficult thing to want to do - so much easier to ignore it! But, should you feel you want it sorted, you need to go about it in the right way. You do it in writing, citing the reasons why you need the worktops redone, and giving them a fixed time to reply and agree. You need proof that they've received this. If, after the time is up (one or two weeks), you then write to say you are getting another company to do the work and you will sue them for the cost in the small claims court.

    That's it.

    You will win - no question.

    And they'll have to pay - you get the 'Sheriff's Office' on to them. They won't want to deal with them...

    Can we ask - how much did the designer charge, and how much did the fitters? And could you scan and post on here the kitchen plan?
  7. goldenboy

    goldenboy Super Member

    I agree with DA. We have all done kitchens where the layout isnt as we would want and thats the customers choice.

    But the leaving the cabinets so far under the tops is just bad fitting and equally so the joint, in fact especially the joint.

    You would win for certain
  8. And the fitters are particularly culpable because they didn't liaise with the customer - they clearly thought 'they'd get away with it'.
  9. sarah martin

    sarah martin New Member

    thank you all again,lots of more good advice which I take on board - I will scan the "plan" into my laptop later (it will be a bit crumpled now) the designer charged me £60,the kitchen company were paid direct & the fitters charged £200 day,they were here for 2 days & there was 1 guy & an apprentice-the kitchen was completely stripped out ready for them to start & all goods had been delivered the day before.
  10. All very reasonable prices - which doesn't help your case :). But, you do still have rights.

    I can understand (tho' not excuse) it from the fitter's point of view; they were charging a reasonable rate and were hoping to get the job done in 2 days. There was no contingency to cover other people's errors. They probably knew that if they pointed out to you the short-comings of the layout, they might find themselves caught between you and the designer in a war to sort it out - and be losing money all the while.

    Still, they did wrong. They did not do a proper job.

    Anyways, let's see them plans - hopefully that will make some things clear :)
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 12, 2014
  11. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    I think that that is the heart of your problem, that was so cheap that no one cared or could afford to care.
  12. metrokitchens

    metrokitchens Screwfix Select

    At that rate I would get the same guys back to fit new tops. The work does seem to be of a good quality - if only they had leased with you.
    Waiting to see the designers plans. :confused:

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