Political correctness

Discussion in 'Just Talk' started by facilities, Feb 5, 2018.

  1. facilities

    facilities Guest

    Just been listening to my local radio phone in concerning pc in the workplace and in general, in the studio was a female expert on such things who is in the process of making a tv documentary on the subject, the D J made a point of saying if he compliments a female member of staff on a new outfit he immediately qualifies this by saying I hope you don’t mind me saying, the expert on these things said that is the correct way of complimenting someone as it give that person an opportunity to reject the compliment, is it me or is this P C gone mad ?
  2. Dr Bodgit

    Dr Bodgit Super Member

    Its PC gone mad. Offense is always taken, never given. Stephen Fry said something similar but has the F word in it, so I didn't post it.

    KIAB and facilities like this.
  3. Dr Bodgit

    Dr Bodgit Super Member

    I mean, why would someone (female or otherwise) wear a nice/smart outfit? To make them look nice, presumably. A complement is just that.

    Now if someone is looking drab and I make a comment that they don't look nice, I can understand that that may be offensive and I should have kept my mouth shut. Its common sense.
  4. retiredsparks

    retiredsparks Super Member

    As real man...and master of his own house....who values his genitals and life...I feel that I must confirm that I have never seen the Lady of the house looking anything other than
    scintillating, adorable, fabulous and bewitching in any and all outfits of her choice at any time of day or night.
    facilities, KIAB and Dr Bodgit like this.
  5. Dr Bodgit

    Dr Bodgit Super Member

    RS and his full length mirror :D
  6. retiredsparks

    retiredsparks Super Member

    Also listen to Jordan Peterson....ripping left wing liberal snowflakes apart at every turn. Including the terminally stupid Kathy Newman.
    JR Mogg.
    Milo....so much fun.
    Peter Hitchins.
    Marie Sivyour and Dr Bodgit like this.
  7. facilities

    facilities Guest

    I’m retired now but spent the last few years of working life on the office side of things, there was a mix of male & female but only a very small number of staff,

    Anyway to cut a long one short most days there was usually good banter that no one seemed to be offended by but I dare say the p c brigade would not agree with,

    There was a married somewhat mature lady who used to sit quite close to myself and we would quite often take the mick out of each other, on this particular day I played a little joke and asked her best mate in the next office to play along

    It went something like this, I used my private mobile to send her a text message on her mobile (her mate gave me the number I have also changed the names here) she was not aware of my number

    ‘Good morning Diane it’s Dating.com here just to advise you your profile has been on the net without any replies for 6 months now, may I suggest we try a week without your photo. Regards. Dating.Com’

    Her phone pinged and I watched her expression as she read the text, under her breath she uttered What! What! and dashed next door to show her friend (who was in on it) she said to her mate Carol look at this text I’ve been sent, Carol read it and said well it can’t do any harm as suggested try a week without your photo, Diane hit the roof and said but I’m not on any dating site! at this she heard the laughter from next door (we all had our ears to the door) she raced in shouting I’ll kill him I’ll bloody kill him and proceeded to chase me round the desk, in the end we all fell about laughing including Diane,

    I dare say the p c people would accuse me of bullying or harassment but we all took it in good fun including Diane who went on to do the same trick herself on one of her friends
    gadget man, Pollowick and Dr Bodgit like this.
  8. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Probably stood behind you, as your typing that!:D
    facilities likes this.
  9. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Those were the days, when you could have a laugh & a joke, & that's how it was taken, but today most things get misconstrue & you risked sexual harrassment,etc,a sad,sad world we now live in.
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  10. Dr Bodgit

    Dr Bodgit Super Member

    retiredsparks, KIAB and facilities like this.
  11. Dr Bodgit

    Dr Bodgit Super Member

    In the early 1990s, worked onsite with a lass who we had a nickname for, due to the amusing acronym associated with the Volkswagen Audi Group car she drove. We'd get shot if used that name nowadays.
    retiredsparks likes this.
  12. AnnaSuffolk

    AnnaSuffolk New Member

    Speaking as a female from the snowflake generation..

    I think it all depends on tone and context. If a male colleague who is usually respectful complimented me on my outfit in a normal setting I would say thank you and feel glad he mentioned it! After all, if a male colleague had a nice new coat or something I wouldn't think twice about saying that they looked nice, kind words make the workplace more friendly IMO.

    If a colleague who is generally a bit of a perve complimented my outfit in a situation where we were alone I'd just brush it off and get on with my day, but yes it would make me feel uncomfortable.
  13. retiredsparks

    retiredsparks Super Member

    How dare you insinuate that I am under any undue threat or pressure to compliment my lovely wife.;) studio-shot-of-a-woman-chef-sharpening-the-knife-over-gray-background-e1ht9c.jpg
    KIAB likes this.

  14. Blimey, the things that exercise Facs enough to prompt him to post on here...

    Why might “I hope you don’t mind me saying?” not be an ok or worthwhile addition to make to a proffered compliment?

    I know, let’s ask a woman.

    Ah, here’s one: Anna from Suffolk, (post #12).

    Precisely, Anna. Context, meaning, intention is everything.

    People who moan that ‘PC has gorn mad’ and how they are now scared to offer compliments or ‘indulge' in a bit of 'banter’ in case it’s taken the ‘wrong’ way need to take a sophistication pill. It ain’t hard, you know.

    Anna has highlighted the difference succinctly:

    One compliment towards her would have been delivered in a kind and respectful way by a person who is always kind and respectful and is known for his kindness and respectfulness. Anna has no difficulty whatsoever in acknowledging that this was meant as kind, respectful, pleasant and thoughtful thing to say to make her feel good. The compliment was a kind gesture delivered for her benefit.

    Anna has equally little difficulty in sensing what’s behind the other colleague’s ‘compliment’. The ‘letch’ has a palpable manner where the compliment is delivered for his benefit; it allows him to run his eyes over a woman he covets, whilst kidding himself that she is going to be submissively pleased that he has so generously recognised her ‘charms’. More than that, he feels confident that there is nothing she can say in retaliation without coming across as either ungrateful or ‘PC gorn mad’; it probably gives this pitiful sap a sense of power over her and he is effectively bullying her into accepting this purely self-serving act. He reckons she ought to be bleedin’ grateful for his leer.

    Gettit, Facs? That’s the difference. And that’s what women have to put up with on a daily basis.

    Is it really hard to be polite and empathetic and to consider the woman’s side on this? If your compliment is really, genuinely a compliment and not a self-serving leer, why would you not wish to add “…if you don’t mind me saying” to be sure to be sure? Compliments are meant to be for the benefit of the recipient, not the giver. That’s the difference.

    (I’m pleased that no-one ‘liked’ Facs post, but very disappointment that no-one has acknowledged Anna’s).
  15. I would normally trip over myself to 'like' a post containing the words of the incomparable Hitch, but I think you misuse his thoughts here, Bodge.

    I'm pretty sure that he is referring to something quite specific in his intolerance of those claiming 'offence'. The wonderful and badly missed Christopher Hitchens had no truck with misogynists or those who shout ‘PC gorn mad’ or ‘Free speech’ when it was only an excuse to allow them to release the contents of their sorry minds.

    Yes, he found utterly contemptible those who claimed ‘offence’ as their only defence against reasoned argument – and took great delight in exposing them all - but I don’t think he’d have been impressed by your use of his statement here. In one of his books - can’t recall which, but probably Hitch 22 - he deplored ‘teasing’ in any way; getting a cheap laugh out of belittling or humiliating (undeserving) folk purely at their expense.

    I think Hitchens have been appalled by Fac’s presumptuous ‘joke’ (post #7), as am I. I cannot believe it’s been ‘liked’ by some on here.

    It’s a fine line. But really not that difficult to navigate.

    I have found, all too often, that those who pretend to love ‘banter’ - teasing and getting one over others in the name of ‘a laff’ – are incredibly thin-skinned when the tables are turned; it’s suddenly not very ‘funny’ at all.

    Very often the tables are not turned against these folk just because everyone knows that they cannot take it as they give it; they know what would happen if they tried. The irony is that the uninvited recipients of this ‘banter’ often show more consideration to the pitiful and undeserving sap who’s issuing it than he (almost always a ‘he’…) does to them. It’s the thin-skinned, fragile-ego’d bully syndrome. And “It’s only banter” is their excuse. Their get-out clause.

    So it’s all about context. Meaning. Intention. And Facs, in my view, has totally crossed the clumsy line with his example.
  16. Yes, of course she 'took it in good fun'. Which, of course, was the only 'intention' behind it. Probably x 2.

    Let’s look at your example, Facs; thank you for being so open and honest (ie: devoid of self awareness).

    A married and ‘somewhat mature’ lady became the butt of one of your ‘jokes’. I would speculate that pretty much all ‘somewhat mature’ women and men are fully aware of their advancing years and the toll that takes on their physique. Some will be ok with this, others less so. Some may be struggling. Some may be having a hard time at home with a tetchy relationship and be really feeling a bit afraid and insecure at what the future holds. All perfectly natural and normal, although it’s a shame we set such store on ‘looks’ and ‘yoof’ these days. But we all know we are losing what we once had, and it ain't coming back.

    But the sensitive Facs thinks it’ll be a great lark to make fun of this ‘somewhat mature’ lady’s physical appearance, in public, where she cannot but accept it as a ‘joke’ (without coming across even worse); a joke that's completely at her expense and no-one else’s. The ‘giver’ of this ‘joke’ just stands back and watches.

    Facs, would you have said to her face “If you ever join a dating agency, don’t include a photo?” Good, pleased to hear that. But it’s ok to wrap it up in a ‘lark’?

    Now, I do acknowledge that the way you put this ‘joke’ together was pretty clever and actually quite funny in itself. But was it - what’s the word - kind?

    What would Christopher Hitchens have to say about it? Or Stephen Fry? (I’m pretty sure I know. I’m certain I know.)

    I am appalled at it, Facs. Honestly, I am. And hugely disappointed that it has been ‘liked’ by some others on here, instead of being challenged. How you could have imagined that this, frankly quite cruel, ‘joke’ would be a good example of acceptable ‘banter’ defeats me. It just isn’t, pal. Not by a long chalk.

    Put yourself in the position of an ageing and potentially insecure woman (yes, I know you’ll claim she’s a strong character/up for a laff/ready to give as good as she gets/etc etc) who has – in public – had the mick taken out of her because of her looks. Isn’t there a single fibre in you that recognises that you may – just may – have taken a risk with this? Misjudged this ever so slightly? No? Really?

    (Or is it the only way you can get women to chase you around the table these days?)

    Put it another way - you will no doubt claim that you would take it with equal hilarity if a woman in that office played a similar trick on 'older' you, citing - I dunno - hair loss, libido loss, sagging jowls, spreading midriff, the suggestion that you do not include a photo in any dating advert. LOL! How you'd laugh! On the outside.

    And even if you were that unbovvered (which I doubt very much), what makes you think you can launch this at others? At their expense?

    And what else do most folk who kinda know they don't have a proper argument for their behaviour do? Yes, get on the offensive and make up some hopefully-derisive terms as if it makes a point, names to call their nemesis; snowflakes, leftie-libs, PC gorn mad. Yes it does make a point, but not the way you think. Let's not forget 'Remoaner'. Always good for a chuckle.

    Oh no! Don't mention B*****! I will - 'cos it's no coincidence at all that Facs and RS are also staunch ‘Leavers’. I have always claimed there are largely two types of folks, and I stick by it.
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 9, 2018

  17. Is that always all a 'compliment' is, tho', Bodge? Really? If given by you, I would hope and imagine it would be so.

    But one proffered by Facs or RS or Harvey Weinstein would, I imagine, leave any self-respecting woman feeling very unclean for at least a decade.
  18. Why oh why did you 'like' this Bodge? :(

    RS's was a post of pure irony. Alloyed with ignorance.

    RS is adding Mogg, Milo and Peter (oh, why miss out Hopkins?) to Bodge’s list of anti-PC spokepeeps.

    RS really does not get it. And that is why this is still such a big issue these days.
  19. facilities

    facilities Guest

    Sorry I didn’t get passed yer first paragraph DA but life’s to short, thank god yer back I’m sure it will help all the insomniacs on the forum :)
  20. Speak for yourself, KIAB.

    I regularly have a very BIG laugh and a joke on this forum. Yes, usually at other's expense. Very deservedly.

    And I know exactly how it is taken - it's the way it was intended.

    Very very rarely does anything I say be misconstrued, and certainly - neither here or in 'real' life - will there ever be a 'risk' of it being 'sexual harassment' or 'etc'.

    And I don't walk on eggshells either.

    If you can't be relaxed about that, then - yes - you live in a sad sad world. But it ain't the world's fault. It's the misogynists'. And the bigots'.
    KIAB likes this.

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