question about fitting butt hinges

Discussion in 'Carpenters' Talk' started by HIGHCROFT, Jan 2, 2007.

  1. dirtydeeds

    dirtydeeds New Member

    last year june/july i was repairing a box sash window, the carpeneter had written his name and date he installed the new sash frame on the back of the weight pocket
  2. Mof

    Mof Guest

    Well dont want to answer again on this subject but it looks like all us joiners in wales and yorkshire are realy bad people as it seems we dont let THIN steel hinges into the frames of internal dooor. Given that the thickness of most frames at the rebate are only about 20 mm do you think it wise to cut into this thin section and weaken it still further? As for being thrown off sites I think it would be the blokes who p**s about cutting into the frame who would be thrown off.
    City and Guilds first class pass, ABICC 1960,s
  3. Jonny Round Boy

    Jonny Round Boy New Member

    Has anyone else uncovered anything interesting ?

    I did a kitchen for an old couple back in August. Detatched bungalow. When I toook the old worktop off, there was some writing on the plasterwork behind the units. It was the guy who'd built the house - had his name, the date (sometime in 1970, IIRC) and stated that it was a self-build by him, and that the total cost of the build was £5,700.
  4. dirtydeeds

    dirtydeeds New Member

    OH the 1960s, the time of peace and love

    and the use of the very LOWEST possible quality materials and workmanship, doesnt sound like youve changed

    you're not the worst people in the country by a long chalk

    but me and the guys i work would **** ourselves watching you work then quitely suggest you left site BEFORE the forman came round
  5. malcolm1417

    malcolm1417 New Member

    Hi yorkshireman,
    I found it quite laughable that as you put it,youve never heard back from me,A common place practice doesn't make it
    a correct one.
    I am sure that by now you are aware that your previous door
    hangings have been rather amateurish and that from now on
    your hinge recessing in both door and frame, will inspire
    the next generation to attain your professionalism.
    Just think, you could always write your name on the bit of cardboard you use for packing(only kidding),
  6. joesoap

    joesoap New Member

    Now you've really gone and hurt our feelings Deedsy. No respect for we old codgers but now we all know why and where the wafting of urine on the sites was coming from. And we were blaming the poor quality timbers. So go change your pants and learn to control your bladder before mixing with the men. Cheers !
  7. dirtydeeds

    dirtydeeds New Member

    nobody has yet convinced me that laying hinges on a door lining is correct. apart from convincing me the door was hung by the local DIY night class ;)

    joe im hurt beyond belief :) )
  8. joesoap

    joesoap New Member

    Hi Deeds you know I agree on the hinges and the banters good old fella. Cheers !
  9. dirtydeeds

    dirtydeeds New Member

    less of the "old"

    i cant win :(
  10. yorkshireboy

    yorkshireboy Member

    Hello Malas its such common practice how do you explain your previous post that you,ve never seen it in 40 years,have you heard of specsavers..;)
    Deedsy, these are some reasons why chopping into the frame is unneccesary.
    The only way a door ever fails is when the top hinge pulls the screws out of the frame.In theory if you used both methods on two doors and then tried to pull the door off,.the door which was housed to the frame would fail first as you have removed some "meat" from the frame.Imagine you are fitting a heavy fire door to one of those crappy thin linings with plant on stops using thick ballbearing or spring hinges .My method is far stronger,think about it there is 6" of timber to screw into the door and 1" on the lining why make it even less.

    When I fit a door if the gap between the top rail and frame is slightly out I can raise the hinge to get it spot on,if the hinges are chopped into the frame its too late unless you leave gaps under the hinge.I often see a big gap above dors in supposedly decent work in pubs etc,maybe this is the reason.

    In fine furniture work if there are drawers and doors in a cabinet obove each other cutting hinges into the cabinet would break the clean vertical lines.

    You know it makes sense dd ;)
  11. dirtydeeds

    dirtydeeds New Member

    yorkshireboy theere are half a dozen reasons why hinge screws are pulled out of the lining and none has got to do with the weight of a door

    they all have to do with how they are hung, how screwed, how shot in and the years and amount of paint applied

    hinge screws work in shear not in tension, they dont need to be any longer than 25-30mm to hold a door in place, however heavy

    as for crappy thing linings on fire doors, people shouldnt be using them

    if you have scibed in the head correctly AND measured out you hinges on the door and frame correctly you shouldnt need to adjust the hinge pockets to raise the door

    cant comment on "fine" furniture work, i dont do it
  12. Mr. Handyandy

    Mr. Handyandy Screwfix Select

    Not wishing to start a fight, but...

    "When I fit a door if the gap between the top rail and frame is slightly out I can raise the hinge to get it spot on...."

    It won't be if you fit it properly. (Door fits the hole, hinges marked and cut in----door still fits the hole).

    Mr. HandyAndy - really
  13. ShabbaPlanks

    ShabbaPlanks Member

    My veiw on this is stated in the second post of this topic before I get slated.;-)
    I decided to check some text books....housing the hinge to the door only is mentioned. The purpose being to offset the knuckle, no mention is made to the purpose of offsetting the knuckle. if anyone has a copy of Peter Brett wood occs level 1, have a look at page 208. Though it would appear the hinge is angled so must be housed to the frame on the rear edge, though this is not clear from the diagram provided the method is stated as "all in the door".
    I myself would never choose this method, only if the existing doors are fitted in this manner or the spec calls for it(new build). It would appear that "butt hinges" is the new "scribe or mitre".
    By no means am I mentioning this in support of not housing to the frame :)
  14. dunc

    dunc New Member

    I have seen doors fitted with shiny gold 2 or 3 inch butt hinges, mounted on the door lining/frame. But I have to say its usually by 'have a go' diyers.

    I fit all internal and external doors with the hinges set into the frames/lings. Tending to use 4 inch steel interior and 4 inch solid brass exterior. Its just good discipline and finish.

    However when I do my cabinets and such like I surface mount hinges on both the framing and the doors.

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