Rats nest under the kitchen sink

Discussion in 'Plumbers' Talk' started by mbrijun, Sep 11, 2019 at 7:43 AM.

  1. mbrijun

    mbrijun New Member

    Please could somebody share what "good looks like" under the kitchen sink for the cold and hot water pipes. What I have at the moment is a bit of a rats nest.

    I was searching for some pictures on google, but no luck.

    For the cold water there is 1 incoming mains pipe from under the floor and 6 outlets: washing machine, dishwasher, kitchen tap, front garden tap, back garden tap and finally a pipe that goes upstairs to the bathroom.

    For the hot water, a pipe comes from upstairs and only feeds the kitchen tap.
     
  2. KIAB

    KIAB Well-Known Member

    Post a photo.:)

    Sometimes it can be difficult to tidy up a rats nest.
     
  3. The Teach

    The Teach Well-Known Member

    sounds like Manifold plumbing,it has advantages but only if installed correctly :)

    if it aint broke,leave it alone ;)
     
    KIAB likes this.
  4. KIAB

    KIAB Well-Known Member

    Point to point plumbing.:)

    Can look very neat,shame we don't see more of it.
     
  5. mbrijun

    mbrijun New Member

    It sort of is broken. The previous owner thought it was a good idea to run a length of a garden hose from under the sink, through the wall, to the front garden. I would like to replace this sooner rather than later, before the aging garden hose ruptures and floods the kitchen. I will post a picture in the evening once I am back home.
     
  6. mbrijun

    mbrijun New Member

    Photo 1 - the shameful hose pipe and 2 tap tails attached directly to a compression fitting.
    Photo 2 - an unused hot water pipe for a washing machine - not sure any machines need hot water these days.
    Photo 3 - a newly installed ball valve (replacing a seized-up stopcock) and a hammer arrestor. It connects to a compression fitted tee - are these any better than soldered in tees?

    20190911_191452.jpg

    20190911_191552.jpg

    20190911_191536.jpg
     
  7. mbrijun

    mbrijun New Member

    I have read up on manifold plumbing. I got the impression that it is popular with under-floor heating systems, but not for cold water systems. At least in the UK.
     
    The Teach likes this.
  8. spirits are real 2016

    spirits are real 2016 Well-Known Member

    what's wrong with photo two as long as its fitted the right way round then that how it should be fitted..the outside hose job isn't how i would have plumbed it in but at least you have a isolater valve to turn it off.
     
  9. The Teach

    The Teach Well-Known Member

    The hozelock fitting & hose can be removed and the necessary compliance valves fitted to supply an outside tap connected in copper pipe.
    If the unused wm hot supply is mains water,cut it back to the nearest tee and cap off.If its tank feed just blank off the wm 3/4 inch thread with a 3/4 inch blanking cap.
    Replace the flexi tap connector (which is not being used as a tap connector,intended use issue) with copper pipe :).

    Its an hours job for a proper plumber :)

    After seeing the photos its not a manifold system,just a system that has been diyed over the years. ;)

    Manifold systems employ a continuous run of plastic pipe with the only joints being on the manifold & point of use. Thats how plastic pipe should be installed ;)
    https://www.uponor.co.uk/products/drinking-water-and-plumbing-systems/manifold-vs-branch-plumbing
     
  10. mbrijun

    mbrijun New Member

    Not sure I understand this part. The flexi tap connectors are feeding the tap. The problem lies in them being connected to a compression fitting directly, risking the damage of the rubber washer.

    I agree with this completely. Manifold's modular approach appeals to me a lot, while a rat's nest does not.

    From what I have seen (mostly on the Emmeti site), the manifold approach is either associated with press-fit or monoblock/eurocone compression fittings. Press-fit requires an expensive REMS press, and the eurocone connectors do not seem to be readily available in the UK.
     
  11. Joe the Plumber

    Joe the Plumber Active Member

    I nearly always connect flexible tap connectors directly to isolator valves like that, the only point to note being I always file the end face of the isolator valve flat to give the rubber washer a chance to seal properly. It's not necessary to remove all of the chamfer, I aim to get a flat face 2mm wide all round.

    My water hammer arrestors (three - gulp!) at home are fitted into the exact fittings shown in your last photo. I don't think you can get a capilliary (ie soldered) equivalent as you still need the 1/2" BSP female thread for the arrestor to screw into. The full bore lever valve is okay as a mains stop tap as far as I'm concerned (again, just like the one I've got at home).

    There's a firm in Cumbria making washing machines with both hot and cold feeds but they're not widely available at present, so you'll be fine getting rid of the hot feed.
     
  12. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Well-Known Member


    The ‘problem’ highlighted in pic 2 and picked up by the OP is the flexi tap connector attached directly to the iso valve

    Tapered face on the iso possibly can cause damage to rubber flexi washer if overtightened and/or give a poor seal

    Sure there’s millions like this around the country with no problems but not recommended

    ‘Tap tail adaptors’ are good here, compression fit to iso, then a flat face to screw flexi to

    Apparently you can get iso valves with a flat face for this reason but I would guess, not often used or seen ?

    Have read on here suggestion of filling of the taper from iso valve to give a flat face but why bother when you can buy the correct item or use the adaptors in the first place
     

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