Reconnecting kitchen undercounter spur socket

P

pal123

Member
I'm doing a friend a favour.

In their property their kitchen cabinets were refitted. Behind the new cabinets an old under counter dishwasher single socket was disconnected and then hidden from view behind the new cabinets.

To put a dishwasher in again, this single socket needs to be reconnected. I'm assuming that it originally spurred off from the above counter twin socket.

Here's a photo showing the undercounter socket: https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=XZDO20XZfAPQOgPkQHjMR75ih9hBTLpDeE9y.

The electrical certificate says that the kitchen ring pain serves 12 points. I have cut out the circuit designation tables from the certificate and attached them here: https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=XZQU20XZjUwrxpjm6vypLDqpDpxRlzn05X9k.

Usually connecting a spur, assuming the other 12 points are all ring mains, should be fine. Is there a reason why this single socket can't be spurred off the twin socket above?

Cheers
 
pal123 said:
Is there a reason why this single socket can't be spurred off the twin socket above?
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Yes. Your post is littered with the word “assume”.
You need to test and confirm that the socket is indeed spurred from a ring final and not a d socket that’s already a spur. Plus carrying out other basic tests and checks.
 
Bazza said:
Yes. Your post is littered with the word “assume”.
You need to test and confirm that the socket is indeed spurred from a ring final and not a d socket that’s already a spur. Plus carrying out other basic tests and checks.
Click to expand...
The single socket is disconnected - I tested this.
I will check if the double socket is ring main or a spur itself. What other checks do I do?
 
If the twin socket is not a spur in itself, adding just 1 spur to a ring main of 12 shouldn't need an electrician. Do these tests legally need to be done just to add 1 spur to a kitchen ring main?
 
pal123 said:
If the twin socket is not a spur in itself, adding just 1 spur to a ring main of 12 shouldn't need an electrician. Do these tests legally need to be done just to add 1 spur to a kitchen ring main?
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Nah! Of course it doesn't. As you have so cleverly surmised, it's just a sneaky scam by so called sparks in an effort to make more money. You just crack on old son, everything will be fine! Testing pah, that's just for dummies.
 
How about 1) count the number of points within the area (which should sum to 12), 2) visually check behind each socket to count which are spurs and which are ring mains and 3) if the number of spurs is 5 or less (meaning 7 or more ring mains) then it's safe to connect another spur. This is going by the rule of thumb that the number of spurs off a ring main cannot exceed the number on ring mained points.
 
Have you loosened off from the wall the double socket ? It appears that the single socket still has a cable connected to it ? If so ,where does it go, could it be in situ behind the double socket ?
 
pal123 said:
This is going by the rule of thumb that the number of spurs off a ring main cannot exceed the number on ring mained points.
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There is NO SUCH RULE. Sometimes all the sockets are spurs when the ring runs around upstairs and all downstairs sockets are spurred from it.
 
Banallsheds said:
There is NO SUCH RULE. Sometimes all the sockets are spurs when the ring runs around upstairs and all downstairs sockets are spurred from it.
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If you look at the PDF attachment drive link (electrical installation certificate) it states that the kitchen has it's own ring main which services 12 points. There have been no electrical amendments since then. The 12 points are the only loads on that kitchen ring main and all are in the kitchen which is a single room. Therefore why is it insufficient to count the sockets (12), visually check that each socket is a ring/spur then connect the 1 socket under counter spur?
 
How will you visually confirm that a socket is a ring final socket ,as opposed to a spur supplying another spur ?
What testing will you do to establish the ring final is complete and not broken ?
 
terrymac said:
How will you visually confirm that a socket is a ring final socket ,as opposed to a spur supplying another spur ?
What testing will you do to establish the ring final is complete and not broken ?
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Fair enough. There happens to be a gang socket above the counter top which is live. Is there a kitchen counter top cable sleeve I can use?
 
pal123 said:
Fair enough. There happens to be a gang socket above the counter top which is live. Is there a kitchen counter top cable sleeve I can use?
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Not really with you ?
The single socket below work top has a cable attached does it not ? Where does it lead to ?
 
terrymac said:
Not really with you ?
The single socket below work top has a cable attached does it not ? Where does it lead to ?
Click to expand...
Yes the single socket has a single cable attached to it which leads vertically upward to the above counter twin socket. The undercounter single socket is dead. The above counter socket is live. I am assuming that the single socket was previously a spur. I have 2 options: 1) drill a 5-8mm hole through the kitchen countertop, remove the dishwasher plug, thread the cable upward through the hole, reattach the plug, then plug in the existing twin socket or 2) reconnect the dead single socket to the above counter twin socket via a fuze. Option 1) doesn't change add anything electrical. Option 2) needs a fuze switch above the kitchen counter connecting to the undercounter socket. Is there anything wrong with option 1?
 
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