Should the UK remain as a member of the EU?

  • Thread starter Thread starter nffc
  • Start date Start date

Should the UK remain as a member of the EU?

  • Yes

    Votes: 34 28.1%

  • No

    Votes: 83 68.6%

  • I don't know

    Votes: 2 1.7%

  • I don't vote

    Votes: 2 1.7%
  • Total voters
    121
If we come out trading with the EU could entail conditions that would be no less onerous than if we stayed in.
Nissan and Toyota have both expressed their preference for us to stay in the EU.
A not inconsequential number of City of London financial firms would move to Frankfurt.
Eurofighter and Airbus are a result of European co-operation which might well be prejudiced if we leave.
Most employment protection laws came from Brussels and employees rights might well be eroded particularly if the Labour Party persists in making itself unelectable.
Irrespective of the fall in the oil price Nicola Sturgeon would push for another referendum on Scottish independence which could lead to England, Wales and Northern Ireland being outside the EU and Scotland applying and getting membership which would be a farcical position IMHO.
Apparently other countries such as the USA and China cannot understand why we would want to leave.
 
joinerjohn1 said:
Apparently, no other country in the world is dictating to either the USA or China. :p:p:p
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USA 's population is about 340 million.
China's population is over 1.3 Billion
EU's population is over 500 million.
We are now a medium sized country by population.
Most large enterprises are owned by Multi-National or European Companies such as French Utility Companies and German rail-freight.
I heard that there were states in the US that would prefer to be independent.
China does enough dictating to it's own citizens without being dictated to from outside.:)
The USA might be dictated to by its foreign creditors if it ever defaulted.
What I am trying to say is that it is a small world and everything is more and more interconnected as time goes by.
Germany was dozens of separate states less than 200 years ago.
If we do come out and the EU collapses it won't do us any good with Putin waiting in the wings.
It is not IMHO too much of an exaggeration to suggest that a Brexit could precipitate another European War.
Along with the situation in the Middle East, ISIS and the possibility of Donald Trump becoming the next president of the USA it would not need much of a trigger.
I for one do not want to rock the boat.
 
Phil the Paver said:
DA, while I agree to 90% of what you say about the UK, I fail to see its relevance to whether we are in or out of europe, do we suddenly become an uncaring nation without the EU.???

It's a typical Yes campaigners reaction, not actually followed up by any facts.

Give us just 3 good reasons to stay, reasons that's we can't possibly do on our own, instead of calling people Twits, Morons, etc etc.
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That is the key. Examples of something the EU does that we CANNOT do for ourselves. I don't think there are any such examples.

Out, out, out!
 
PaulBlackpool said:
If we do come out and the EU collapses it won't do us any good with Putin waiting in the wings.
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That is all just assumption and scaremongering.

What people want to see is hard facts of what will happen if we vote out and as yet none have been given. There has been lots of maybe's but, no firm and factual answers to what will really happen.

So the Japanese car makers might pull out of the UK if we vote out. They might also transfer manufacturing to another country if we vote in. There is no firm answers to these questions.
 
Phil the Paver said:
DA, while I agree to 90% of what you say about the UK, I fail to see its relevance to whether we are in or out of europe, do we suddenly become an uncaring nation without the EU.???

It's a typical Yes campaigners reaction, not actually followed up by any facts.

Give us just 3 good reasons to stay, reasons that's we can't possibly do on our own, instead of calling people Twits, Morons, etc etc.
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We can do it on our own, it's chust that it's best if we are together.

There are probably good financial reasons why it's better to be part of the EU (notice how sterling is having a wobble?), but I don't know much about that. But there are issues like the number of British jobs directly associated with our membership.

For certain, many of the world's companies who set up their factories in the UK do so 'cos we have this direct link to the EU market.

But, away from these issues, reasons why I feel strongly we should remain?

1) The EU needs us :).

Ok, ok - I mean by being part of the EU we have a strong voice when it comes to things like, ooh, imposing sanctions against Russia. Making decisions that will affect the future of Europe, our immediate, democratic neighbours after all.

2) When bad things like recessions happen, historically people move to the extreme ends of the political spectrum; far right wanting to pull up the drawbridges and start flogging people, and the far left wanting screw the rich and scatter the money amongst the poor. People are drawn to 'extremes', and that is why the likes of UKIP, the BNP, Trump and Corbyn start to get mass followings.

This doesn't work. It is just a gut reaction. It didn't work for Greece, and it won't work for anyone else. However, it does lead to a more fractured society (see what's happening in the US?), and antagonism between countries too. That ain't good, folks. We should be uniting with as many like-minded folks as we can, for the greater good. And then showing the rest of the world how it can be.

Don't forget, it ain't a million miles from wot set Hitler on his course.

3) This will make many cynics spit out their tea, but the EU is actually responsible for some wonderful human rights laws. The likes of Wry - a good christian - simply doesn't give a flying jobbie about other people, but - man - we are all humans and we should all treat each other with care. Cynics will rant on about 'straight bananas' and PC gorn mad. But all these rules are working towards making us a more decent, equal, fair & healthier society.

4) The right to move around these countries with impunity.

5) A united Europe is surely going to be a safer and more secure place that a divided one? If the likes of Trump ever became president, and - lord help us - a loon like Farage PM here (ok, no chance), the same could happen in other countries who go it alone. Jingoism become rife, and protectionism too. The excellent relations we currently have with our partners could be lost. (Don;t forget the lessons from history).

6) I like the EU. I like being a part of it. I like being united. I hate jingoism. I hate the thought of Great Britain breaking up - for that will surely happen if we leave the EU.

These are from the heart. If I surf, I will certainly find 'technical' reasons why it's a good idea too.
 
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joinerjohn1 said:
Exactly the reason the EU extract the urine at every turn DA. In the negotiations the EU have thrown Cameron a few crumbs, nothing more.. No wonder his face was a picture when he left the negotiations. ;);)
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Oh for heaven's sakes, JJ, please cut the glib remarks... (shakes head sadly).

No wonder you like people like Farage - it's the same kind of populist, glib, cynical ejaculations that come flobbing out of his gubby gob.

Don't you blush when you say things like that? Have you no shame?

Fnurr fnurr - 'extract the urine' Guffaw. 'A few crumbs'. Chortle.

It's abject nonsense. And you should know that. These are stupid, meaningless, worthless remarks.
 
PaulBlackpool said:
USA 's population is about 340 million.
China's population is over 1.3 Billion
EU's population is over 500 million.
We are now a medium sized country by population.
.
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You forget that the EU just isn't a country, it's a whole load of not so wealthy individual countries, run by some German bint called Merkel. :p:p:p:p
 
joinerjohn1 said:
You forget that the EU just isn't a country, it's a whole load of not so wealthy individual countries, run by some German bint called Merkel. :p:p:p:p
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And isn't she wonderful...? :D


Seriously, she's an impressive lady :).

She is.
 
Devil's Advocate said:
the EU is actually responsible for some wonderful human rights laws..
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Ahh would these be the ones that allow foreign criminals to remain in this country?? You know the ones.. The government try to deport them because they have committed heinous crimes. The crim appeals to the ECHR and that's it. No mention of the human rights their victims should have enjoyed ??
 
Devil's Advocate said:
And isn't she wonderful...? :D


Seriously, she's an impressive lady :).

She is.
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That impressive her immigration policy is the real threat to splitting Europe up even her own people are seeing that now. Unless you ment impressive in another way ! in which case you really are a pervert :)
 
joinerjohn1 said:
You forget that the EU just isn't a country, it's a whole load of not so wealthy individual countries, run by some German bint called Merkel. :p:p:p:p
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When Portugal joined the EU, it started systematically closing down all the Portuguese production plants. The owners were paid compensation for this. Guess what? Now Portugal rely solely on German imports.

There is only one country doing well out of the EU and that is at the expense of millions of normal people around Europe.
 
joinerjohn1 said:
Ahh would these be the ones that allow foreign criminals to remain in this country?? You know the ones.. The government try to deport them because they have committed heinous crimes. The crim appeals to the ECHR and that's it. No mention of the human rights their victims should have enjoyed ??
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Glib.

Daily Mail.

etc etc etc.
 
proby said:
That impressive her immigration policy is the real threat to splitting Europe up even her own people are seeing that now. Unless you ment impressive in another way ! in which case you really are a pervert :)
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And yet Germany is taking in more refugees than any other country. Wow. Why is that, I wonder?

Two reasons I can instantly think of - (1) Germany under Merkel is a better and more progressive and more civilised place than most other countries under whoever, and (2) what will Germany do with all these very bright, talented, grateful & driven Syrians?

Thrive...


(It's worth taking another look at your post above. Re-read what you've said. The thought and research behind it. Ie - none. Just standing at the side, throwing whatever carp that comes into your hapless brain. I mean, 'her' immigration policy? No, it's the EU's very decent and fair immigration policy actually. 'Even her own people are seeing that now'? Again, silly you, that's a 'no'. Except, of course, for the minority - the Germanic version of people like you.)
 
What a load of tripe, it's well reported the ordinary German citizen is turning against her on immigration. It was Merkel who invited them with no quoters not the EU.
Bright talented Syrians have you got access to their records, a large amount are not Syrian or are you such a twit not to know that. Refugees claim asylum in the first safe country Migrants just enter illegally.
 
Devil's Advocate said:
And yet Germany is taking in more refugees than any other country. Wow. Why is that, I wonder?

Two reasons I can instantly think of - (1) Germany under Merkel is a better and more progressive and more civilised place than most other countries under whoever, and (2) what will Germany do with all these very bright, talented, grateful & driven Syrians?

Thrive...


(It's worth taking another look at your post above. Re-read what you've said. The thought and research behind it. Ie - none. Just standing at the side, throwing whatever carp that comes into your hapless brain. I mean, 'her' immigration policy? No, it's the EU's very decent and fair immigration policy actually. 'Even her own people are seeing that now'? Again, silly you, that's a 'no'. Except, of course, for the minority - the Germanic version of people like you.)
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German asylum law is separate from the EU.
Merkel has been in retreat for weeks now. Publicly sticking to her meaningless rhetoric and in private capitulating to her critics.
 
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