Shower Mixer Valve Install

Discussion in 'Plumbers' Talk' started by MarkyBoy, Mar 6, 2004.

  1. MarkyBoy

    MarkyBoy Member

    I would like to install a new shower into a bathroom that has never had a shower before. It will be in the corner but both the walls are stud walls (plasterboard). Can anybody please tell me how I can run the pipe-work inside a stud wall and fix the shower mixer without wripping the stud wall apart ?

    Also, what is the easiest shower mixer valve to install, exposed or concealed ?

    Thankyou
    Mark
     
  2. bilco

    bilco New Member

    It would be ideal to remove the plasterboard inside the shower area and replace it with aquaboard or such, if you are going to tile the walls. If not tiling any alternative would fix in place of plasterboard or require aquaboard anyway.
    Once the board is out of the way, you have the ideal situation to install pipework/shower fitting etc. Take advantage of all that space and fit concealed.
     
  3. MarkyBoy

    MarkyBoy Member

    Is it essential to use aquaboard when building a new shower ? Are there any alternatives ?
     
  4. dewaltdisney

    dewaltdisney New Member

    Hi MB,

    I have just done this and Bilco is spot in with his advice. Cut the plasterboard out and plan your shower housing. You may have to install a sub frame to beef up the timber where you will be fixing the aquapanel and also any shower screens, rails etc. Do drawings or take a photo of the studwork before you cover it up, it is amazing how soon you forget where everything is once it is covered up.

    I used the Mira 415 shower valve as they are a true and trusted design and you can get repair kits for them. They are easy to fit and come with straight forward instructions.

    Aquapanel is around £12 a sheet and you will need a couple for a shower back. (See the Knauf website) Worth every penny. Remember when drywall screwing to keep then away from where you are going to fit the shower screens etc. Do not ponce about with anything else, get Aquapanel.

    Use good quality tile adhesive and grout, see BAL website.

    Fit full bore service valves in an accessible place if you can, just in case.

    Good luck,

    DWD
     
  5. ormus1

    ormus1 New Member

    all the above advice is spot on. use aquapanel, nowt else. fit service valves just in case. well worth the few extra quid.
     
  6. MarkyBoy

    MarkyBoy Member

    Thankyou all for your comments.

    The shower is to be installed into a corner. One wall is plasterboard and the other is a breeze block partition wall. The otherside of the breeze block wall is the airing cupboard containing the hot water cylinder so I will mount the shower valve on this wall and feed all pipework through the wall from the otherside.

    Can I fix the aqua panel over the existing plasterboard wall rather than removing it the plasterboard ? This would then save a lot of hassle "making good" the areas where the existing plasterboard and new aqua panels meet.
     
  7. dewaltdisney

    dewaltdisney New Member

    Marky,

    I would suggest building a stud wall over the breeze wall to facilitate easy plumbing. It is possible to mount the aquapanel over the plasterboard but as it is the same thickness as PB by removing this section of PB it would look better for flush fitting. Of course you will be tiling over so it really is down to the finish you require. I would cut the PB out though as it is not hard to do.

    The stud work can be made up out of 3 by 2 inch sawn timber and this gives you the opportunity to 'square' the corner for a better fit if necessary. Pull your feeds through the breeze and plan the studs so that you can support the concealed valve. Rawlplug the studs to the wall and run noggins at the points where the aquapanel will join. When the plumbing is in test for leaks before boxing in with the aquapanel. I would recommend compression fittings rather than pushfit joints here.

    I would also suggest getting a stone resin tray with tiling upstands, you do not want leaks. Make sure that the floor is sound with no movement, if there is flex build a platform for the tray out of more 3 by 2 inch (across the joist timbers) and 3/4 (at least) ply for the top. Allow for waste runs.

    That is all I can think of,

    Hope this helps

    DWD
     
  8. MarkyBoy

    MarkyBoy Member

    Thankyou DWD for your detailed response. The shower I am fitting is a 800 x 1200 offset quadrant. I have a run of 900 along the plasterboard wall before it hits a door so I could aqua panel over the plasterboard up to the door fram and lose the aqua panel lip against the door frame. The breeze block wall is 2.92 metres long and reduces in height with the eaves of the roof after about one meter (still sufficient height for a shower though). Therefore, building a stud wall would be a bit of a nightmare and, unless I built the wall along the whole 2.92 metres length,the stud would stick out from the rest of the wall. Can I mount the shower valve into the breeze block wall directly and feed the pipes from the airing cupboard behind ?

    Thanks again.
     
  9. dewaltdisney

    dewaltdisney New Member

    Marky,

    It is difficult to visualise a project from words alone and the scenario I have built in my mind is obviously different from the reality. I am thinking that you are going for a built in valve rather than surface mounted so my thoughts were focussed on creating a housing for this. Lots of these problems go away if you surface mount the valve, but this does not look very professional.(Not that I am) I was steering you away from cutting the valve into the wall as sure as s* you will go right through the breeze if you try to chisel it out. This in turn can lead to more problems.

    One further idea would be to use the existing plasterboard wall for your valve housing. You could build the supporting platform for the tray and run the feeds under this to come up into the studwork. This would mean taking the PB off though.

    I suppose I am letting my personal worries come into this advice as I would never mess around with a breeze wall as I think chiseling out would weaken the wall. Studwork is so easy with basic tools, and it does allow much easier plumbing.

    I hope I have not confused you and I would recommend doing the job the way you feel most comfortable. Come back if you need any expansion on any of this as I am pleased to be of help.

    DWD

    .
     
  10. MarkyBoy

    MarkyBoy Member

    Thankyou again for your comments DWD. Yes I am intending to use a concealed valve. I am also using a raised tray in order to resolve a problem running the waste. If I was to use the plasterboard wall instead of the breeze wall the mount the valve, how would I secure the valve in the plasterboard wall ? The other problem is that the plasterboard wall is only about 10cm deep and I can't make it much deeper as it would stand proud of the door frame. Is there really a major problem mounting the valve in a breeze wall ?
     
  11. dewaltdisney

    dewaltdisney New Member

    Hi again,

    Have a look at the PDF instruction booklet for the Mira valve I have.

    http://www.mirashowers.com/onlinecatalog/shower_features.jsp?item=118016&prodnum=415

    You will see that for studded walls there is a metal bracket supplied which will support the valve. You can secure to a ply backplate fixed between the studs. All basic stuff really. I have posted a picture of my job in progress that shows this a bit more clearly.

    http://uk.f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/dewaltdisney2003/detail?.dir=/Screwfix&.dnm=e211.jpg

    My job is a replacement fit but the original studwork was a bit naff so I strengthened it in parts. The temporary batten just above the valve is to help locate the aquapanel.

    The 100mm gap you have is plenty as most valves are designed to fit in the standard cavity wall.

    As far as working in the wall, which is probably a celcon block rather than breeze, I guess you would need an SDS drill with chisel. I just think that it is the harder option, and have no experience of how easy or hard it is to do. There is a solid wall behind the false wall in my picture, but it is so much easier to do it with studwork.

    Hope this gives you a better image in your mind.

    DWD
     
  12. MarkyBoy

    MarkyBoy Member

    Thanks again DWD,

    Are you using a pump with your valve ? I have gravity fed hot and cold and will boost this with a 2 bar pump.
    The area where the new shower will go is currently occupied by a sink corner unit. Both the plasterboard wall and breeze block walls are currently plastered and painted. How would I go about cutting away the existing plasterboard to reveal the studwork behind ? This does now seem the better option to hacking away bits of breeze block to fit the valve. I would then cover the studwork with aqua panel but I am not sure how to make it flush with edges of the plasterboard !
     
  13. dewaltdisney

    dewaltdisney New Member

    I am sorry but I have no experience of shower pumps as I have a combi boiler and the hot water is more or less mains pressure.

    Have a look at the DIY workshops on the Knauf site as there is a lot of info on Aquapanel.

    http://www.knaufdiy.co.uk/

    Cut lines in the existing PB with a sharp craft knife along the outline of where you plan the Ap to meet. nibble away from the furthest corner and establish where the studs are. When you get near the cut line take a bit of care but you will find it will break along the cut line with a bit of gentle bending. Watch out if it is a an original PB join line as there will be clout nails or drywall screws that may cause difficulties. Ap is the same thickness as PB so the edges will mate well. The PB skim coat will not cause that much of a difference in levels but you can overlap part of your tile to cover the join gap or fit some trim.

    Beef up the studwork with some more noggins and studs to support the AP fixing. Cut holes in the Ap for the valve and shower outflow using a jig saw from a pilot hole. (I used an old blade)Make sure you put some extra timber to give something to screw shower panels and accessories into before boxing in. All this is a lot clearer as you work along and you can actually hold things in place.

    Hope this helps.

    DWD
     
  14. MarkyBoy

    MarkyBoy Member

    Many thanks DWD. Now I feel reasonably confident about the project.

    Cheers
     

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