TATA

Discussion in 'Engineers' Talk' started by malkie129, Mar 30, 2016.

  1. malkie129

    malkie129 Screwfix Select

    If TATA can sell off all of the UK's steel industry,then maybe they can finance India's space programme with the profits. The money that our government gives to India in "foreign aid" could then be spent in this country helping to keep the steel plants maintain production. :mad::mad::mad:
     
    Ghost-1 likes this.
  2. Brian_L

    Brian_L Active Member

    Being a communist (apparently) I still feel saddened by the demise of British steel. At least with national companies people had a job to go to, if not a job for life.
     
    KIAB likes this.
  3. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    I suppose (at the end of the day) it is a private company. If you owned such a company and it was making a loss, would you keep it open? Would you depend on government subsidies to make a profit? I do agree about foreign aid though... Shouldn't be given to countries with nuclear weapons, space programs etc. Let em finance their own nuclear and space programs.

    Brian, I have to disagree about "Nationalised Companies" My dad worked at Stanton and Staveley ironworks in the 70's when it was "nationalised by the government. Before it was nationalised, the workshop he was employed in had 6 blokes on each shift, producing x amount of finished pipes. A few months after nationalisation, it had almost 30 blokes on each shift,,,,,, producing exactly the same amount of finished products,, (and they all got a bloody wage rise to boot) Surely you can't tell me that was right? (think about it,,, who was paying their wages? )
     
  4. chippie244

    chippie244 Super Member

    It is a short term solution though, at the moment steel prices are low because the Chinese economy has faltered so they are selling their excess, government subsidised, steel off cheaply.
    Once you shut down a steel works, economically, you can't reopen it.
    When the markets pick up the Chinese will increase their prices and as by then we will have no means of producing steel we have to pay it.
     
    tore81 and Brian_L like this.
  5. proby

    proby Active Member

    Having family work for Tata I can tell you Tata buy and sell steel bought from all over the word including China not just made in Britain as do other companies. Each company has to make there own profits and that means buying from the cheapest source that often means buying from abroad so in effect cutting there own throat.
     
  6. Brian_L

    Brian_L Active Member

    You can't tell me it's any worse than having 6 people employed who are paying taxes that are used to pay benefits for 24 blokes staying at home unemployed. Don't forget they would be getting income tax from all 30 when they are employed.
     
  7. Brian_L

    Brian_L Active Member

    Market share tactics, that's why you don't see any British made TV's. When the Japs starting selling TV's and other electronics here in the UK they made a loss on everyone they sold. Then when all the British TV makers had gone bust, they had the TV's market to themselves practically.
     
  8. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Ahh I see,,,,, Makes complete economic sense then? When the business goes down the pan and everyone ends up on the dole.... You just haven't thought this through have you?
    Thing is Brian, my dad only worked in one small workshop, on a site employing thousands. At the time it was nationalised, it was making a profit. The months afterwards it was always making a loss and closed down. You tell me who the winners were? Certainly wasn't the government, certainly wasn't the men and women employed there.. All nationalisation does for any business (and think about this carefully) is make employees dependant upon the state.. (something which Old Labour wanted everyone to be) ;);)
     
  9. proby

    proby Active Member

    Trouble with nationalised companies people think it's money for nothing, remember British leyland. Got relatives that worked for British steel in the 70s would happily work a double shift then go fishing, mind you they spent half the shift asleep. But I do think the likes of gas, electric and water should be state owned.
     
  10. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Sadly the last Labour government made sure they were sold off (mainly into foreign hands) Wonder how much these foreign companies would want in payment if they were nationalised?
     
  11. Think you find it was maggie that sold them off.
     
    Brian_L likes this.
  12. Totally agree with you Malkie.
    Why should we borrow a minimum of £12 billion a year to give away to all and sundry.Charity starts at home.
     
    Brian_L likes this.
  13. Brian_L

    Brian_L Active Member

    Your argument is a bit lopsided, if a company cannot survive being a nationalised (heavily subsidised by the government) company, then it just doesn't have any chance that it would survive in the private sector.

    The whole purpose of nationalised companies was not to make a profit but, to provide a service and to provide jobs. Much like GPO telephones, British rail etc.

    Thatcher and her "every man and woman a capitalist" campaign didn't do this country any good.

    One of the worst cases of privatisation has to be the railways, the privateers can squander the ticket money on bonuses for the execs and the government has to give them huge subsidies to keep those trains rolling.
     
  14. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Ahh I see now Brian. It doesn't matter how much an industry loses in money as long as it just keeps on going.. Nice one. ;);)
     
  15. sospan

    sospan Screwfix Select

    Having worked previously with the various parts of TATA, they are not a nice company and from my experience they treat their staff worse than if they were slaves.

    What isn't made known, is that their off shore deals and Indian based staff working in the UK make very little tax or national insurance contributions.
     
    Brian_L likes this.
  16. Brian_L

    Brian_L Active Member

    I cannot see anywhere that I stated that! ;) You made that statement!

    If you actually read what I wrote about the railways you'll see that I don't agree with the government throwing money at things just to keep it going, especially when it's going into the pockets of the fat cats.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2016
  17. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    So what do you want to happen with TATA ? Do you expect the government to step in ? If so, what do you think they should do?
     
  18. Brian_L

    Brian_L Active Member

    I think the government should do nothing at the moment. Nothing worse than spending tax payers money to prop up private companies.

    If TATA cannot find a buyer and still wish to close it down then the government should make them a very low offer for the whole site on a take it or leave it basis and then run it as the national company it once was.

    The price of steel will eventually go back up again.
     
  19. kiaora

    kiaora Guest

    Nice to hear a younger voice talking good sense, if my business is loosing money, why would anyone make me an offer. What would you pay for a business with no orders? Only my vans and tools maybe?


    Like he says, the industry will bounce back, and we'll be ready to cash in, providing the work force agree?


    Regards

    Peter
     
  20. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Well
    that's the end of that then. Cheers EU (and some people still want us to remain in it) :D:D:D

    Source,,,, http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/artic...ferent-when-it-comes-to-a-government-bail-out
     

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