Timing belts versus timing chains

Discussion in 'Car and Van Talk' started by diymostthings, Nov 27, 2012.

  1. diymostthings

    diymostthings Well-Known Member

    We have saved up for a new car which we hope to buy over the Christmas period. One factor in our decision as to what to buy is the timing belt. I heard this has to be changed after about 80k (with dire consequences if you don't) but with a timing chain, this doesn't ever need replacement. How do I find out which cars have timing belts and which timing chains? I've found the brochures pretty useless - even the sales staff in the showrooms didn't know!!  The two cars we are seriously looking at are the Mondeo Estate and the Skoda Superb Estate (both petrol). Do diesels have them as well?

    Thanks for any words of wisdom!

  2. Yes, diesels can have them too.

    You need to go a little bit further than chust the make and model of car - you need to look at the exact engine used. I think you might find a list of chain-cam engines on the Honest John website - you could certainly ask on there if the info ain;t obviously available. (Bearing in mind that, just as on this forum, the info given will only be as good as the person giving it...)

    Another possible thing to look out for are DMF (is that the acronym?) - Dual Mass Flywheels. These fancy beasts have moving parts (no, I don't just mean they spin...) and they have a hellish reputation for breaking up - at significant cost.

    Post the exact engine models on here and we'll have a delve in a quiet moment...
  3. PS. I know, I know, I know, that a brand new car is a wonderful thing, but...

    Are you sure you wouldn't prefer to save around half the cost and buying a nearly-new?

    Our aging Zafira (diesel - chain cam...) was a new purchase, and that was all good and well. What a treat...

    One week into our ownership, wifie reversed out her folk's drive thinking she'd cleared the low border wall. She hadn't. Nice low gouge in rear door.

    2 weeks later, when I was clearing a forest of fekkin' conifers from t'front garden, I tripped over a branch with a pair of secateurs in my hand. That took care of the front passenger's door.

    We'll no doubt have to replace the '03 wagon pretty soon. I'm seeing high spec, low mileage '09 plate models for around £6-7k. Will I pay £20k+ for the same model? Not a fuffing chance...
  4. Oh, and if you go diesel, check out DPFs. (Ok, I've prob got that wrong too...) Diesel Particulate Filters or similar. These are good things in that they capture all that nasty carp wot comes out t'exhaust (and it is horrible stuff...), but it relies on the car being given a few good, longish runs at regular intervals so's the carp gets burned off.

    Having said that, my in-laws have a MINI Cooper diesel and do tonnes of very short runs to the shops with an occasional 10-mile trip being the longest trip. Never had a problem...
  5. Woooohooo, you're thinking to yourself; I've had 4 replies to my post!

  6. G Brown

    G Brown New Member

    Mazda petrol engines are mostly chain driven, Ford use Mazda engines in their cars. Toyota petrols engines are often chain drive too.

    You would be mad to buy diesel now. Small petrol engines is where the future is. Look at the amazing 1.0ltr engine in the Focus for example.
  7. diymostthings

    diymostthings Well-Known Member

    OK DA for that extensive response! Well the models we are thinking of are the Ford Mondeo Estate 1.6 ecoboost Edge and the Skoda Superb Estate 1.8 TSI Ecoboost. I'll take a look at the Honest John website - thanks for that. As for the depreciation etc. we tend to buy new and keep cars for 10-12 years. i thinkl buying new gives you the max chance to look after it properly and achieve long life/high mileage. that has certainly been the case with our existing Mondeo estate.


  8. G Brown

    G Brown New Member

    The Mondeo is selling very badly and is overpriced and oversized, it depreciates like a bomb. Previous Mondeos were good cars, not anymore. It is a bloated Yank Tank now.  Look at the Focus. A much better car for your money. The Ford diesel is made by Peugeot and is belt driven as is the VW engined Skoda.
  9. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Nothing wrong with a nearly new car, perhaps a few years old. can be well under half the cost of a new car. Remember a new car can have just as many problems as a secondhand one. ;)
  10. diymostthings

    diymostthings Well-Known Member

    Thanks for that GB - yes we have one of the older Mondeo's (2003) but it doesn't owe us anything and I can get my cement mixer and stand in the back (as well as a three piece suite in two journeys!). Also a three meter length of copper pipe goes in with tailgate shut. the new ones do seem pricey though, and there is an all new Mondeo coming out next spring in the UK. Might wait to seee what that's like.We also liked the safety features (air bags all round etc.).
    The Focus would be too small. The Skoda has fantastic legroom in the back and gets good write-ups.

    Thanks for taking the time to respond

  11. diymostthings

    diymostthings Well-Known Member

    Thanks again GB - well some of the Diesels have zero road tax (I think the "Stop/Start"?). but I don't like diesles anyway having had a bad experience with one. I don't like the way they rev tham at MOT either!

    thanks again

  12. diymostthings

    diymostthings Well-Known Member

    Thanks JJ. good points well taken,  but I like the thought of no MOT for three years and the warranty. Also after three years the batteries are sinking, the exhaust is starting to corrode, brake pads need changing, new tyres needed etc. - it all adds up!

    thanks for your advice

  13. G Brown

    G Brown New Member

    The Skodas are good, very good. My missus has a Fabia vRS hatch. Nice n nippy! Dead reliable too. I always buy my cars new and have done for years...no  - it does not make sense! the depreciation makes a huge dent in the economics...but I do like a new car! :) I have to decide what to get next when my BMW 1M coupe gets to three years old!
  14. diymostthings

    diymostthings Well-Known Member

    Well I'm not into "prestige" cars - I looked at a Merc and quite honestly the headroom inside was very limited - the roof height was significantly lower than my Mondeo! I couldn't see anything inside or out to justify the extra expense. As for performance, a litre of petrol has a fixed amount of energy in it, no matter what car its in!

    thanks for the skoda recommendation - yes we like it but the superb estate is failry new. We're leaning (heavily!) that way now!

  15. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Steer well clear of Merc's. My older brother had one. After 22 months the gearbox failed.  Mercedes were so concerned that they shipped the gearbox back to Germany to find out what had failed and put it down to "mechanical failure" (but still didn't offer to replace it unless my brother paid for a new gearbox) Not much change out of £6000.:'(
  16. Captain Leaky

    Captain Leaky New Member

    Diesels are on the way out. Mark my words. Small petrols are making a big comeback. In another ten years diesels will only be found in lorries and buses.
  17. diymostthings

    diymostthings Well-Known Member

    Yes - I've never really liked them. If they made one as quiet as a petrol engine I think they might survive.

    Thanks for the comment

  18. Hmmm, the MINI Cooper I mentioned above has - I think - a 1.6 diesel with stop/start. Purrs like a petrol, very very nippy, and returns over 60 mpg. And free road tax.

    Anyways, there is an Honest John list of chain-cam cars - see?

    DIY, if you like a new car, then you like a new car - no probs with that. Also, your logic in wanting to know that it's been cared for throughout its long life is fine too.

    However, I think your arguments start to fall apart pretty soon after that... Diesels being revved at their MOTs? Yep, fair enough - they can handle it (especially if chain cam...). Battery and exhaust failing? Not necessarily - my Zaf's on its originals. Brake pads? Yep - but that's going to be a regular issue anyways (just did the Zaf - £50 for new front discs and pads - the maost straight-forward task to replace). New tyres? Well, yes - you'll need a new set virtually every year. Costs soon adds up? Yep - but not to £10k...

    Anyways, if you plan to hold on to it for a long time, then fair enough.

    Check out places like this. Sis-in-law used it to knock around £4k off her RCZ - at her local dealer... These are not imports - they are supplied by proper UK dealers of each make. They just compete for your business.
  19. Chust did a drive the deal on your Moneo. List price is £20,350. DtD price - delivered to your door, fully taxed, is £16, 310.

    And my cut is around...
  20. diymostthings

    diymostthings Well-Known Member

    Thanks DA - yes I use DTD all the time. Sorry!


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