Turn single socket into a junction box for an new unfused spur?

Discussion in 'Electricians' Talk' started by DaleP, Oct 12, 2018.

  1. DaleP

    DaleP New Member

    I have a radiator in my lounge that is abnormally high (approx 300mm from the floor, compared to 150mm for all other radiators in the house). I presume that it was placed here because there is a single plug socket under the radiator that the original installer wanted to maintain access to.

    I am now replacing the radiator and would like to take the opportunity to lower the position of the radiator, so as to reduce visual impact in the room.

    Additionally, my preference would be to convert the socket to a junction box and use this to create an unfused spur to the opposite wall, where I would add a double socket (this would be an additional 3m of 2.5 T+E cable). From what I can tell this is allowed under Part P regulations although I am happy to be corrected...

    I've read that wire terminations should be easily accessible for maintenance. Does behind a radiator count as this? Are there other options for adding the socket?

    Also, to make the junction inside the back box, should I use a standard 20A junction box (example https://www.screwfix.com/p/30a-3-te...gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CLys7I_P_90CFYYaGwodvuAJPg) - however at 91mm diameter it doesn't look like it would fit inside a single gang back box?

    Many thanks!
     
  2. retiredsparks

    retiredsparks Well-Known Member

    If JB is to be covered by rad it's not accessible....so you have to make it Maintenance free.
    Look at Wago connectors... and related wago connection boxes.
    test the alteration...before putting rad on(call me old fashioned...lol)
    You are allowed to do this work.
    RS
     
  3. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Well-Known Member

    How are you running the 3m of cable to other side of room ? Lifting the floor ?

    If so, make connections under floor (maintenance free and enclosure) and do away with the wall plate totally
     
  4. Bazza

    Bazza Well-Known Member

    What he said ^^^^^
     
  5. seneca

    seneca Screwfix Select

    Depends which way the cables run doesn't it! If they come down the wall use Wago connectors in the back box and fit a blanking plate.
     
  6. Comlec

    Comlec Well-Known Member

  7. DaleP

    DaleP New Member

    Great - thanks so much for all the advice so far. This is all really encouraging.

    Yes I am planning to route the new spur cable under the floorboards. Should this be cable clipped, or just run resting on top of the garage roof ceiling board?

    So it sounds like 3 x Wago 3-Way Lever Connectors would act as the junction box for earth, live and neutral. Guessing they would not need an enclosure since they would be within a back box?

    The only remaining issue is the position of the junction box. It seems that it cannot go behind the new position of the radiator, so either we need to a) keep the rad at its current height or b) move the entire back box to below the new radiator position?

    One factor which might help is that there is another single gang socket on the same ring main in the hall which almost backs onto this radiator socket - have tried to draw this below, together with the ring cable directions in red...

    [​IMG]

    I'm presuming that the hall socket won't help us here because the cable that comes vertically up to tje lounge socket still needs to be joined somewhere, and in a maintainable location.

    Thanks again for all the help...
     
  8. retiredsparks

    retiredsparks Well-Known Member

    Technically, the wagos should be in a suitable MF labelled box with cable grip mechanisms.
    If you can fit one...do it....althi i suspect the dimensions wont work.
    RS
     
  9. seneca

    seneca Screwfix Select

    I know you're correct RS but personally I don't consider cable restraint when they're in a back box and plastered into the wall.
     
    retiredsparks likes this.
  10. retiredsparks

    retiredsparks Well-Known Member

    If it were for myself...I would be happy with sheaths well taped together so as to limit vibration/movement...but we cant advise him to do that can we..;)
    Rs
     
  11. DaleP

    DaleP New Member

    Thanks RS and seneca. I think I get the 'maintenance-free' aspect now - in that this classification is itself designed for inaccessible situations. Nice!

    I've just researched and I think a wagobox will fit into a 47mm double-gang back box, so chiselling out some more of the wall to convert the single 35mm back bod into a 47mm double is an option (though not a fun one - even all the internal walls here are breezeblock).

    Am currently researching any other possible 'maintenance-free' junction boxes to see if there's anything that needs less than a 47mm double box.
     
  12. retiredsparks

    retiredsparks Well-Known Member

    Ashley J803 Maintenance Free Junction Box 32A 3 Terminal
    140x65x30

    Rs
     
  13. Bazza

    Bazza Well-Known Member

    In a double socket box + cables?
    I don’t think so…
     
    retiredsparks likes this.
  14. Comlec

    Comlec Well-Known Member

    Don't let the pursuit of perfection drive out the good. Put the Wagos in the existing back box and put a blanking plate on it. It will be hidden by the radiator, but still there for future use. Spend your effort on making sure the circuit is extended correctly, cables clipped where necessary and all cables properly terminated and connections tightened.

    And for peace of mind you should test your work. If you don't have access to full test gear then at least use a basic socket tester. Something like this
    upload_2018-10-12_16-8-17.jpeg
    Good luck
     
    retiredsparks likes this.

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