VOTE UKIP

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PaulBlackpool said:
i do not deny that Blair took us into an illegal war on the strength of a dodgy dossier and I think that Doctor Kelly was murdered but what about Libya? The pension raid of not allowing pension funds to claim Advance Corporation Tax was started by the tories (1/I6th) but I agree that Brown put the boot in with the other (5/6ths) but IMHO the Tories gave him the idea. Re. non jobs , as I tried to explain above I am not convinced it makes much didderence in the long run. What I think is that the Tories ( & I have often voted for them in the past when they were a centre-right party) have & will clamp down on the things so much that there will be insuficient economic activity to reduce the debt which has doubled in the past 5 years.
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Regarding David Kelly, I know for a fact that his family find it incredibly disrespectful and upsetting that bar room lawyers like yourself continually bring his sad death up again and again and claim it was murder. It absolutely 100% wasn't and his family know for certain that he took his own life.

But then again why let a families grief and stone cold facts get in the way of a conspiracy theory.
 
You are obviously better informed than I am. Can you point me to the source of your information?
( No disrespect intended) . If it was suicide what drove him to it? I suppose we will never Know.
 
Absolutely better informed Paul. Bearing in mind I can tell you that the family are fully happy with the coroners verdict it should be fairly obvious. None of the campaigning or claims of coverups have anything to do with the family.

As for what drove him to suicide what business is it of yours? Did you know him? Obviously not.

Suffice to say there is absolutely no doubt about what happened from anyone who actually knows the circumstances. The only people chucking about fanciful theories and ideas about sinister events on the internet are those who know the square root of sod all.
 
goldenboy said:
Absolutely better informed Paul. Bearing in mind I can tell you that the family are fully happy with the coroners verdict it should be fairly obvious. None of the campaigning or claims of coverups have anything to do with the family.

As for what drove him to suicide what business is it of yours? Did you know him? Obviously not.

Suffice to say there is absolutely no doubt about what happened from anyone who actually knows the circumstances. The only people chucking about fanciful theories and ideas about sinister events on the internet are those who know the square root of sod all.
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"Suffice to say...."

No it isn't.

That's the benefit of information, so as it can be given, and so that people don't have to draw their own conclusions.

NOT repeating the facts leads to this sort of guesswork and that's where it all gets out of hand, leaving people to make up their own minds(which is nearly always cynical!)

Mr. HandyAndy - Really
 
Yes it is Handy. Those who know the circumstances of his death, ie those people with any legitimate reason for having access to the information have absolutely no concerns about the coroners verdict.

Nothing will stop conspiracy theories but in the case of David Kelly there is no big secret, no big coverup just a set of very sad events.
 
Thank you Goldenboy - really appreciated.

I almost replied to the Dr Kelly comment, but felt too exasperated to do so.

If anyone wants to peddle a tiresome and completely unsubstantiated conspiracy theory for their own 'arguments', it should be done with something of value to back it up.

It ISN'T good enough to just claim something and then challenge others to 'prove it ain't so'.

It's up to those making such silly claims to be prove it is so.

The stress the poor man felt under is well documented. He was such a principled character that he couldn't cope with what he felt was his lifetime's reputation being irreparably tarnished.
 
goldenboy said:
Yes it is Handy. Those who know the circumstances of his death, ie those people with any legitimate reason for having access to the information have absolutely no concerns about the coroners verdict.

Nothing will stop conspiracy theories but in the case of David Kelly there is no big secret, no big coverup just a set of very sad events.
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Maybe it is just information that was requested by PB, not proof.
Merely that he'd like to see some evidence to further allay his suspicions.

Not too much to ask, eh!

Mr. HandyAndy - Really
 
No problem mate.

The issue with the internet is that very quickly word spreads about some fanciful theory or rumour and it quickly becomes "accepted fact" by those with an axe to grind.

You only have to look at the Lord McCalpine situation where vast tranches of the internet were happily and gleefully leaping on totally false information and painting an innocent man as a paedophile. A man who subsequently died shortly afterwards.

Sources become blurred and lack of evidence is completely ignored just to keep ignorant gossips happy and occupied. Those who spend their time peddling nonsense theories and suchlike all over the internet are nothing but paranoid modern day versions of washer women chatting over a fence.
 
Mr. Handyandy said:
Maybe it is just information that was requested by PB, not proof.
Merely that he'd like to see some evidence to further allay his suspicions.

Not too much to ask, eh!

Mr. HandyAndy - Really
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Allay his suspicions? What business is it of his or yours the circumstances of a mans death? None that's what. There has been a coroners verdict, the family are fully happy with the verdict, end of story. Why do they want ghoulish speculation all over the internet.

It has absolutely nothing to do with you or anyone else. Its a private matter.

It is absolutely too much to ask.
 
goldenboy said:
Allay his suspicions? What business is it of his or yours the circumstances of a mans death? None that's what. There has been a coroners verdict, the family are fully happy with the verdict, end of story. Why do they want ghoulish speculation all over the internet.

It has absolutely nothing to do with you or anyone else. Its a private matter.

It is absolutely too much to ask.
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Yeah, there was a inquest verdict when our son was killed by a driver, we didn't accept the findings but had to live with it. End of story.
Don't mean a toss.
This man was in the public eye, wasn't he?

You seem to have all the details. was it any of your business?

And if the truth is out there, THAT is what should be spread.

Not, "I know the truth, but I'm not telling you."

Mr. HandyAndy - Really
 
But a simple 'link here' see for yourself would have more than sufficed.
PB just want to be pointed to the source of your information.

Mr. HandyAndy - Really
 
I am really confused Handy, surely it is obvious that I am not talking about this from something I have read onlin

How can I link to something that isn't on the internet?
 
"PB just want to be pointed to the source of your information."

No he didn't, Mr Ha. PB asserted "...I think that Doctor Kelly was murdered..."

PB is as capable as anyone at finding impartial, substantiated info on the 'net should he wish - he doesn't need links provided by anyone else.

He chooses to believe something else.
 
Devil's Advocate said:
"PB just want to be pointed to the source of your information."

No he didn't, Mr Ha. PB asserted "...I think that Doctor Kelly was murdered..."

PB is as capable as anyone at finding impartial, substantiated info on the 'net should he wish - he doesn't need links provided by anyone else.

He chooses to believe something else.
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But DA, as Goldenboy points out, there is nothing on the internet to link to.
How can I link to something that isn't on the internet?
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The David Kelly thing was of national interest.. Still we only have to wait another 50 yrs for the truth to come out. If it's so simple, why wasn't the truth made public? Call me cynical, but anything where the government's involved is enough to make everyone cynical.
 
JJ, I'm not referring to what Gb says - he has personal info that we don't.

What we do have available to us - for the rational of mind - is the result of a full, impartial investigation which you have to be more than merely 'cynical' about to refuse to accept.

I think the measure of your critical thinking, JJ, is summed up by comments such as "...why wasn't the truth made public?" and "anything where the government's involved is enough to make everyone cynical."

It was. And, only if you want to be.
 
On the whole I'm always a bit sceptical of conspiracy theory's about government departments telling lies. But then you get things like Hillsborough and IRA letters giving a free pass coming to light. So I don't know what to think when officials and experts start talking.
 
Fair point, Proby.

A a huge dose of healthy cynicism is a good thing.
 
Crikey! My research re. The late David Kelly. went no further than Wikipedia and the Daily Mail and my "thoughts" could easily have been gleaned by anyone reading those sources. I have not the inside information that Goldenboy apparently has and no DA I did not do extensive research before making my post. If that was necessary there would be no point in having a forum at all, if everybody could find information elsewhere. If I have upset anyone I apologise profusely.

I think I will give this forum a miss for now.

I am only DIY and have picked up some good tips and on other threads and just tried to reciprocate in my own simple way.
But if I am that crass and incompetent I better **** off.
 
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