Windows7 to Window 10

Discussion in 'Tech Talk' started by Paul Blackburn, Jan 15, 2020.

  1. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    One happy customer...:)
     
    Joe the Plumber likes this.
  2. DIY0001

    DIY0001 Active Member

    What size is your internal drive? If the 1Tb Seagate is almost empty and larger than the space used on the main drive then you might as well put a complete image of your main drive on the Seagate. Much faster and more secure than using "cut and paste" of what you think are important files, which is guaranteed to miss something that actually is important.

    For Windows 7, from Start / Control Panel select System & Security. Click Backup your Computer. On the left panel select Create a System image and Windows should find the Seagate drive as a possible destination for the backup. Select it and proceed with the backup. Finally, create a restore DVD, which will allow you to completely restore the Windows 7 system from the backup in the event of a disaster.

    Once you follow Kiab's advice for the upgrade from Win7 to Win 10, you will have the opportunity to easily revert back to Win 7 for at least 2 weeks. The update should keep all of your files and applications if they are compatible with Win10. The full system image will allow you to revert back after that, if necessary.

    The main issue I have with Win10 is that updates are compulsory and, unless you take steps to circumvent it, requires that all peripheral drivers are Microsoft approved and digitally signed by the manufacturer. If you have old peripherals, such as scanners or printers, expect to lose hair getting them to work with Win10! It is usually possible, but needs repeated with every compulsory update.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2020
  3. DIY0001

    DIY0001 Active Member

    What I mean is that the Windows 10 upgrade will also create a temporary image of the Windows 7 system. For 2 weeks (could be longer, I can't remember exactly) you can restore these using the Windows 10 Update / Restore function in Settings (the little cog on the Start Menu). After a while, Windows 10 assumes that you are content with the upgrade and deletes the temporary image files.
    However, if you have taken a complete system image, as I described above, you can restore your Windows 7 system at any time after that. (And you can then use the upgrade to go back to Windows 10 again, if you so desire.)

    The main "problem" I have with Windows 10 is that it will only install drivers that have been approved by Microsoft and are digitally signed. I have a couple of important peripherals, such as film scanners, which are too old to have signed drivers and Win10 refuses to install them. There are ways around this and force them to be installed, but it is a Royal PITA: every Win10 update is compulsory and that will uninstall those unsigned drivers. Again, there are ways around this using, for example, the Group Policy Editor, but some updates even seem to over-ride that.
     
  4. Joe the Plumber

    Joe the Plumber Screwfix Select

    One issue I've been grappling with all day is that my Windows Live Mail (ie my e-mail programme) no longer worked after the upgrade to Windows 10. There's loads of stuff on the internet from people with the same problem, but I've not been able to get it working.

    I've tried the Microsoft Mail programme that's included with Windows 10 but although it works, I don't like it. However, with a bit of hunting, I've found "O E Classic" (www.oeclassic.com) which is a sort of replica Outlook Express programme. I've paid for the full works with it (just over 25 quid, although there's a basic 'two email addresses only' free version) and it's blooming lovely. All I've got to sort out now is how to make it my default email programme.
     
  5. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    GMail for me.
     
  6. DIY0001

    DIY0001 Active Member

    Start / Setup (cog logo) / Apps / Default apps / Email
    That should display all of the email apps on your system, including the OE Classic. Just select it as the default app for email.
     
    Joe the Plumber and KIAB like this.
  7. Joe the Plumber

    Joe the Plumber Screwfix Select

    Thanks, but sadly it doesn't appear in the list for some reason. I've got it pinned on my toolbar so I'll just open it up
    every day.
     
  8. DIY0001

    DIY0001 Active Member

    Apparently that is because OEClassic doesn't properly register itself.
    A quick Google reveals that back in May 2016 the app's authors acknowledged this and promised to fix it as a priority in future releases.
    It obviously hasn't been fixed yet:mad:, so it might be worth contacting them and asking when, if ever, they intend to get round to addressing the priorities that they promised.
     
  9. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    You would think the problem had been fixed by now in OEClassic 3.0.:(
     
  10. Have now got Windows 10 on my laptop so thanks again for all the advice much appreciated.
     
  11. Joe the Plumber

    Joe the Plumber Screwfix Select

    I've just gone back to Windows 7. I really didn't like 10 in spite of, I think, giving it a pretty good go.

    Sorry Kiab, I still really appreciated your help though.
     
  12. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Screwfix Select

    I must admit, i always thought that Win10 was a class behind Win7 especially in a gaming scenario. That isn't the case now though.
    I'm sort of the view that there won't actually be a Win11, Win10 will just carry on getting updates until MS decide to re-write the entire OS architecture. The point is that Win10 is now actually a lot better than Win7 and more to the point more secure and fully able to handle the latest hardware. Win7 will never be able to handle the latest hardware, in fact a lot of drivers for hardware now are not even written with Win7 in mind. As time goes on it will be much the same as the transfer from XP to Win7, yes your computer will boot to the desktop but your browser won't be secure and your new printer won't work ect ect.
     
  13. DIY0001

    DIY0001 Active Member

    That may be the case some way into the future, however the problem up to now with Windows 10 is that is doesn't support most of the installed base of legacy printers, scanners and other peripherals while there is no incentive for manufacturers to write trivial modifications of drivers to ensure Windows 10 compatibility for what are, to them, discontinued products.

    For example, I have a Nikon film scanner which was fairly expensive when new, certainly several times the cost of the Windows 7 computer it was attached to and driven by. Nikon has never updated the driver to be Windows 10 compatible, and Windows 10 directs users to a 3rd party app which doesn't retain many of the original features of the scanner. So many users simply dumped the film scanner in landfill.

    However, by editing one line in the driver installer for Nikon's latest scanner it will recognise and fully support the older scanner in Windows 10. Just add the old scanner's hardware ID to the driver installer. The modification even installs the correct colour management profiles for the older scanner!

    And this isn't just an issue with expensive, relatively specialist peripherals.

    The same thing applies to an Epson wireless printer/scanner that we have. Not supported by Windows 10 because Epson won't update the driver. The main difference between Epson's Windows 10 drivers and the Windows 7 driver is the Hardware ID range supported. Modify that single line of code in the Windows 10 compatible driver to add the hardware ID of the older printer and everything works fine. Why don't Microsoft incentivise Epson (and other manufacturers) to do precisely that, rather than have thousands, possibly millions, of users sending apparently obsolete hardware to landfill?
     
  14. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Screwfix Select

    Win7 didn't support older hardware from WinXP either. This was never the fault of Microsoft, it can be laid completely at the feet of hardware manufactures not bothering to update drivers. The manufacturers want you to buy new hardware, so they are never going to update drivers for an old OS.
     
    KIAB likes this.
  15. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    And not wanting to move from 32 bit to a 64 bit OS, even though 64bit gave you better performance in games,etc,& it was not that many years ago you had a 32bit OS & were limted to 4GB of memory (RAM),whereas a 64 bit OS has around 16 extabyte limit of memory.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2020
  16. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Screwfix Select

    WinXP did have a 64 bit version as well KIAB, i used it for years long before Win7 was released.
     
  17. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    That's going back a bit, use to run XP Pro 64 bit myself.

    Win XP64 was relased in April 2005.:eek:

    And you can still download it as a ISO, complete with service pack 3.:)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_XP_Professional_x64_Edition
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2020
  18. kitfit1

    kitfit1 Screwfix Select

    Forgot how long ago it was lol. XP Pro was always my preferred OS for for Benching under LN2 or Phase, why? Because it had no bloatware and was a lot lot faster than XP 32 Bit.
     
    KIAB likes this.
  19. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    Old enough then to remember Ram Drives/Ram Disks.:)
     
  20. Hans_25

    Hans_25 Screwfix Select

    MS DOS loaded on hard sector floppy discs.
     

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