If RCBO'S At £12 A Pop; And Reliable; Could Be Sourced

Incidentally, less than a mile and a half from here on the other side of "that little dotted line they call the border" the use of single pole RCBOs in unheard of (despite the fact that almost every installation is now TN-C-S (Neutralised) with very, very few TT (Direct Earthing) installations left).

 

Unlike a BS EN 60898 circuit breaker they detect a neutral/earth fault but leave it in circuit. It is easy to see how this is undesirable. And as I mention upstream time-delayed RCDs may now operate even after the downstream one.

 

Agreed Risteard, the DP main switch is all that's required.

 

Eh. .?

Whats the reg number for the exclusion on TT supplies?

 

The photo shows 3 DBs, supplying 1 unprotected circuit and 9 x RCD protected circuits.
The 17th Edition Board is £65.00 + VAT, the SP+N RCBO board is £105.00 + VAT and the Compact genuine 2-pole board is £149.00 + VAT.
The SP+N RCBO is 10KA ssc and the Compact is 6KA ssc.
There can be no question as to which arrangement is easier to wire and easier to test (IMHO)

For further information, contact me on david.stansfield@satnet.me.uk
However, like Electricfix, I am Trade Only.

SBS Trade Sales

 

Not lot of headroom there to wire them RCBO's IMO thats the wrong enclosure for them, all other enclosures have far more 'headroom' to ease RCBO terminations

 

Hi Sparky,
The height of the box is 252mm. Which box would you recommend and what height is it?
I am sure you are talking about the Standard RCBOs, so what's your opinion on the Compact RCBOs?
DaveS

 

Those look like re-badged Control gear direct stuff

 

Hi Sparky,

I apologise if I didn't phrase my questions clearly.
My first question was, which box / boxes with heights substantially more than 252mm were you referring to?

When you mention BG comparisons, you are obviously talking about the BG CUR Series, which are very similar to the LIVE Standard SP+N RCBO. The basis of that design has been around for a few years, developed by a Chinese Company Jovian & Rogy.
It is one of the most popular designs ever made and has been sold in this country with Brand names like MK, Chint, SBS, ECD, TDline, LIVE, Contactum, BG and a few others. It is also sold extensively on the world market.

With regard to the Compact RCBO, my Supplier is the Chinese Designer and Original Equipment Manufacturer of this patented design. A few other Chinese companies also build this under licence, but BG is not one of them. BG don't offer this product in their catalogue and if they did, it would probably be a re-badged version of the original product.

So, irrespective of who designed what, my second question was, what is your opinion of the Compact RCBO concept?

I would really value your input on these subjects.

DaveS

 

Interesting set up. Would be interested to know the derating on the devices, do you have a link to the technical spec of them?

Also you might want to correct the torque label!

 

Hi Craig,
This is the spec. of the DL7NL-40. Ironically, their Torque rating is incorrect. When I pointed it out, they discovered their error and it should be 1.6Nm. The product has been CE Certified.
Regarding the Torque Table on the LiVE box, I have no control over that, but if you would like to suggest alternative ratings, I shall pass it on to them.

DaveS

 

Never knew compact RCBOs's existed, looks good with plenty of room too for wiring up.

 

I have sold many thousands of Compacts over the last 5 years to over 200 Electrical Contractors, as I am Trade only.
I have 58 years experience in the Electrical Industry, including assessing electricians for competency, as a NAPIT Field Officer (Inspector). Many of the 250 members I used to assess are now customers, plus NICEIC, ECA, ELECSA, STROMA and BSI registered companies and a few other qualified but non-register electricians.
A few months ago, a customer asked me to join the B&Q Forum, to answer a question about my Compacts, which I did. Despite some unwarranted comments on that post, I picked up several new customers. I joined this particular thread, because it was totally relevant to me.
However, it was not my intention to hijack the Forum, to sell my products, so I shall not be posting in future, unless invited to do so. If anyone wants more information, please contact me at david.stansfield@satnet.me.uk .

DaveS

 

Hi JP,
When I say Trade only, I mean a "Skilled Person (electrically)", as defined by BS7671 page35. If you fit into that category, that's OK with me.

The following information may also be helpful to this thread:-



Electrical Components Direct is a legitimate Company, selling good Chinese products under the ECD brand.
They sell a product similar to my Compact, but it is not available in 40A and the live in is at the top, a configuration rarely used in the UK. Though the product says 4500A ssc, it has probably been upgraded to 6000A ssc. The product on the left of the photo is one available to me, but it is not suitable for the UK market, although sold extensively in Australia and New Zealand.

The Compact RCBO sold by CEF, if my information is up to date, is an MCB size SP+N device, that still needs the flying neutral and earth leads. Mine (SBS or EL) is a genuine DP device, disconnecting both the L & N, in the same way a RCD does and does not have flying leads, in the same way that an RCD doesn't.

DaveS

 

I was recently contacted by a B & Q Forum Member via emal, regarding my Compacts in another metal AMD3 board, rather than my own.
He had stocks of metal boxes and wanted to use one of them. The answer is yes and I do it quite regularly, providing the Main Switch/RCBOs/busbars as one assembly, ready to clip on the DIN Rail.
If you need more info, contact me at david.stansfield@satnet.me.uk

 

Picture two with the compact board and standard RCBO's are the standard type i use and have used for a while know.

After about the 8th rcbo the wiring in the small cavity at the top gets very very very busy and much more difficult so that setup is only capable in reality of a 8 way even though it could cram in 11 or 12.

These compact double pole RCBO boards are very neat, CEF introduced me to them and the switchgear you have in your picture i have no doubt is most likely made in the same factory as the ones CEF have branded up.
The extra headroom would make the wiring much faster and much more effortless, that's some nice gear and seen as wylex as moving so slow to respond to this design i may just move over and begin using boards like you have posted.

Nice product and very well priced.

 

Hi fire,
Thanks for your supportive comments and you clearly appreciate the space-saving aspects of the Compact RCBOs.
You mention CEF products, but they are not true 2-pole devices and are in fact SP+N, as shown in my photo above.
I am aware of several manufacturers of the CEF type, but my Supplier is not one of them and CEF do not sell my product, except:-

I sell to my local CEF Branch one size of Compact, which they buy in for one customer, who has bought approx. 1,000 units in the last 2 years.

The product would be available to other major circuit protection manufacturers, but its application in the UK is different to the application in Australia/New Zealand, where the bulk of these products are sold. In addition, the busbars used in AUS/NZ would not comply with BS7671, as it would fairly easy to touch the live parts, despite being fitted with insulators.

I have designed and had manufactured a unique multi-functional busbar, for which I claim intellectual property rights. Even if others came up with an equivalent busbar system, it would have to cater for a wide range of boxes from say 4-module, up to say 22-module, in LIVE and NEUTRAL configurations and for L/H and R/H Main Switch. It does not therefore lend itself to over-the-counter sales, that's why 95% of my DBs are built to the customers own specification.

As stated previously, I am not about to hijack the B & Q Forum, so if you or others are interested in my Company and its Products, please contact me at david.stansfield@satnet.me.uk. Three other Forum Members have already contacted me this evening.

DaveS