Looking for opinions

Discussion in 'Carpenters' Talk' started by Perry Kneum, Dec 7, 2014.

  1. Perry Kneum

    Perry Kneum New Member

    Hi all, Newbie here.

    Couple of pics from a site I've been doing a bit of sub-contracting on (not related the carpentry). I'd be interested in peoples thoughts.


    Pic 1.


    2014-12-03 15.53.50.jpg

    New extension on house, at the back existing slate roof, to the right existing flat roof and on the left new pitched which will be slated.

    Pic 2

    2014-12-03 15.50.13.jpg

    The rafters in the centre are from the new roof, they have been bolted (6 or 8mm bolts can't remember exactly now) to the the sides of the ceiling joists. The ceiling joists rest on a doubled up 4x2 on a couple of noggins which are on another single 4x2. Under this is a length of 2x1 on it's side. We then have the 6x2s that carry the flat roof. All of the above is then supported on the bit of stud wall shown.

    I suggested to the main contractor on site that this was not the best bit of construction I'd ever seen and was basically told to f-off.

    Anyone got any thoughts before I take it any further?

    Cheers
    PK
     
  2. I take it there is no building control can't believe no steel from block work, what is under the stud wall ? Are they going to ply stud wall as well.what is the boxing on roof in the first picture.
     
  3. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    I'm assuming the 6" by 2"'s that carry the flat roof were already in situ ?? Looks quite a poor method for the new roof support. Should be a steel there. On the outside of the roof the plastic sheeting (under the laths) shouldn't flap about over the lath to the left of the boxing in bit (I too wonder what that's for) Is it purely the single bolts holding the rafters to the ceiling joists? I'd have thought they should also be screwed or at least have another bolt (or more) in.

    I'd recommend getting Dominic Littlewood, to chase these builders up the road, whilst Melinda can blag them a new kitchen/bedroom/ bathroom and some paint from local firms. :p:p:p
     
  4. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Not the best looking job, but if your only subbing on it, why are you bothered what they're doing.
     
  5. FatHands

    FatHands Well-Known Member

    oh yes, not many people could say no to her when she comes around for a bounce JJ ;)
     
  6. DIYDave.

    DIYDave. Screwfix Select

    There's some nice camera work on occasion when MM is climbing a ladder and you get a slow, lingering shot of her climbing the rungs

    Certainly a couple of good points from the front but not too shabby from behind either :p
     
    FatHands likes this.
  7. Perry Kneum

    Perry Kneum New Member

    Right, I'm skipping the points abot Melinda's points. :)


    I'm told (by head bull sh tt r) that it's all been cleared by building control but when I ask for it in writing the toys leave the pram.

    Under the stud wall is a quarry tile floor (on who knows what).

    According to the lads on site, the plan is to PB and skim the stud wall.

    The weird box on the roof is there because the joists go past the rafters and break the line of the roof, so the joist ends have been boxed in chipboard.

    I'm supposed to be fitting solar panels to the pitched roof, part of the certification for my work includes signing off the roof as strong enough for the extra weight.

    PK
     
  8. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Can you sign the part that says the roof is strong enough for the extra weight though? Reckon I'd seek the advice of a structural engineer for that bit. To my mind, it looks rather a flimsy way of supporting the rafters. I'd certainly be asking the head buller for something in writing (or suggest you'll ask BC yourself, if this has been passed by them)
     
  9. I would phone building control myself (do you know the local inspectors) ask them if its been passed. That box is into the valley too whole job looks like right diy job. Definitely not strong enough with the weight of slates and panels
     
  10. Perry Kneum

    Perry Kneum New Member

    Thanks. This is pretty much where I am at the mo. but I didn't want to go all official without getting a few opinions.
     
  11. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Getting BC out or asking if it's been passed is just covering your own back. Phone them , but don't tell the chief bullsh***er, you've done this. Only way it seems your going to find out. Or tell the owner of the property , you can't possibly sign off your certs without knowing the roof has been passed by BC (it now becomes the property owners problem) Are you working for a company or self employed?
     
  12. Mr. Handyandy

    Mr. Handyandy Screwfix Select

    Personally, I think the rafters are a definite candidate for splitting out at the ends under the weight of the roof.

    Aren't rafters ALWAYS supposed to 'sit' on something built up from the ground ?

    Mr. HandyAndy - Really
     
  13. Perry Kneum

    Perry Kneum New Member

    I'm working for a firm, but it's my name that goes on the sign-off.

    I reckon a chat with BC is in order, if only to cover my back.

    PK
     
  14. joinerjohn1

    joinerjohn1 Screwfix Select

    Get your firm to contact BC. Your line manager could pay a site visit and tell the chief BS, he's not happy with the construction of the roof. You might sign everything off, but if anything goes wrong, it'll also reflect badly on the company you work for. ;)
     
  15. Phil the Paver

    Phil the Paver Screwfix Select

    Based on the fact you have to sign off the structure, I now understand why your bothered, as said above get BC to confirm it's suitable for it's required use, this I very much doubt will happen, the way it is at the mo.
     
  16. KIAB

    KIAB Super Member

    With the weight of slates and panels, & maybe a good dollop of snow in the winter on the roof, I wouldn't be happy with that roof construction.
     
  17. moppylhd

    moppylhd Member

    My observations.
    The whole weight of the roof is relying on a few bolts. ??
    The joists holding up the flat roof seem to be sitting on a stud wall. ??
    Boxing in with chipboard, on a roof. ??
    There seems to be far to many bits of timber holding up other bits of timber. ??
    Dont think I would be climbing up that roof, let alone adding more weight.
     
  18. wuddy

    wuddy Member

    There is nothing wrong with studs holding it all up as long as there is a suitable footing under the stud.
    The top double plate should not be there and the rafters would have then run to the lower double plate ontop of the flat roof joists and the ceiling joists would then bolt to the side of the rafters, eliminating the box outside
    There is no point load running down - where the existing flat roof joists run there should be a stud directly under each joist then the pitch roof should have been set out so each rafter lands directly over each flat roof joist.
    If you are subbing to a builder and he is happy with the construction it is his responsibility not yours, you should suggest doing it the way I have said but don't worry yourself if he leaves it as it as long as you get paid for doing what he has asked you to do
     
  19. vivaro man

    vivaro man Active Member

    No way is that safe. Tell him he has 1 week to do it right or you're off the site. Look after your own interests.
     
  20. GrahamTaylor

    GrahamTaylor Active Member

    I think I would be going off to have a chat to the people in building control. Any work of that type should be under their jurisdiction so they should be visiting anyway. In my area they do occasionally cruise around and make unannounced inspections on work that is happening for which no application had been made. If they were given a nod they might just turn up and do a random inspection. I'm sure that they will be keen to protect a 'whistle blower'.
     

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