scorching on splashback too close to gas hob

Discussion in 'Kitchen Fitters' Talk' started by Janet Weir, Sep 9, 2014.

  1. Janet Weir

    Janet Weir New Member

    Can anyone out there help? I urgently need some independent/unbiased professional advice on the following, as the kitchen makers/installers have proposed a solution that makes no sense to us:
    We recently had a completely new kitchen designed and installed by Sigma3 with Neff appliances, including a Neff extra-wide gas hob with wok burner to the left and control knobs along the front (T25S76N0) and Neff oven underneath it. It was a very bad experience, due in large part to a fitter working on his own who often appeared incompetent and out of his depth. Fewer than two months after the kitchen had been in use, a brown scorch mark appeared on the laminate upstand behind the large back right rapid burner (the one that can take a 26-cm pan). The mark is approx. 90 mm wide (the diameter of the burner) by 50 mm high (which is level with the top of the cast iron pan support).
    I consulted the Neff installation diagrams, emailed the project manager/designer and attached measurements and photos. After nearly two weeks, which he said he needed to consult with his technical team (if this includes the fitter who did the work, we are immediately dubious), he replied with an offer to replace the upstand and fit it at their cost. Since the new upstand will be in exactly the same position and made of exactly the same material, I simply don’t see how this would lead to anything more than the same thing happening all over again.
    The hob has been fitted 47mm back from the countertop edge. with only 16 mm between upstand and hob at the back. I have spoken to a Neff customer Service representative who agreed that this seemed far too close, did not comply with their guidelines and was likely to cause scorching.
    The Sigma3 countertop depth is the standard 600 mm but the splashback thickness (approx 15 mm) clearly reduces the useable depth to less than the minimum 600 mm required by Neff.
    According to Neff, for the hole cut out of the worktop, the minimum front and back distances from hob to back wall and front edge to counter are 50mm (front) and 55 mm (back). This is 40 mm either way shorter than the depth and width of the hob.
    The countertop overhang is 45mm, which must be added to any extra thickness in the carcass (possibly 18 mm but I don’t really know enough about it). Even with that it does seem possible that allowing for an overlap front and back of 20 mm, it should have been possible to position the hob even 10 mm further forward, i.e. with more than the existing 16 mm between it and splashback.
    In my email, I pointed out that:
    I have not used saucepans that were too wide and made contact with the splashback (the photo clearly shows that the discolouring is below the level of the pan support).
    I have not used saucepans too small for that burner, and ensured that the flame did not come over the pan sides.
    I have almost never used it on full strength.
    If the maximum pan diameter allowed for this large burner is used, the pan, which itself becomes very hot, is literally one mm away from the splashback surface, difficult to centre over the flame and impossible to rotate if it has any side handles.
    We have now been told that:
    The top cut out is the measurement given as the best position to avoid scorch marks with laminate upstands.
    Having checked with the gas fitter, they can confirm the hob has been fitted in line with both the regulations and manufacturer’s guidelines.
    The hob could not come any further forward or it would compromise the strength of the worktop front.

    What does anyone out there with kitchen fitting experience think (and in particular about the last statement), please?
     
  2. metrokitchens

    metrokitchens Screwfix Select

    Photos?
    Most laminate upstands I fit have instructions to stop 15cm short either side of the heat source ( your hob ). Looks carp like this but there you go. If you take the actual burner position, not the hob edge as your heat source you can get this down to 10cm.
     
  3. Janet Weir

    Janet Weir New Member

    It is 10 cm from laminate surface to heat source. But the scorching still occurred. Photos attached.
     

    Attached Files:

  4. metrokitchens

    metrokitchens Screwfix Select

    Unless that panel is fire proof, which it clearly is not, then it should not be behind the hob. The up stands should also stop 15 cm away from the hob.

    Perhaps a glass panel could be fitted over the splash back to prevent burning.
     
  5. CraigMcK

    CraigMcK Screwfix Select

    Hi, If they designed the kitchen then they are responsible for putting it right. irrespective of your selection of appliances. If the hob was not suitable, then they should have advised you they were not fitting it.

    A piece of glass or matching brushed stainless would solve the issue, but if that's not what you want then they should come up with another option
     
  6. teabreak

    teabreak Screwfix Select

    Clearly the fault of wrong materials and inadequate clearance, also worth checking the hob is correctly set up (gas rate / pressure) have you sent photos to Neff?
    Pretty sure that the last electric hob (Bosch) we had fitted in a rental needed 45 - 50 mm clearance from the hob to the wall, which was quite hard to achieve.

    It is a fact that it is very often difficult to get the clearances makers specify without compromising the strength of worktop at the front, as a alternative an electric hob will be less likely to scorch as the heat is directed into the pan, not up and around as a gas burner that has hot products of combustion that can only escape around the pan.
     
  7. Janet Weir

    Janet Weir New Member

    Many thanks to Craig and Metrokitchens for their input. Please keep any thoughts coming. I emailed the project manager/designer who OKed the final plan and made the offer and asked him how replacing the splashback with the same thing in the same material and position could possibly be a solution -and what his "technical team" had to say about the idea. I await a reply. I can't tell you how relieved I am to hear that at least two professionals out there agree there is a serious issue. I attach two more photos to show exactly the allowance front and back of the hob. Thanks again.
     

    Attached Files:

  8. snezza30

    snezza30 Member

    In my opinion, the hob has been fitted too close to the laminate back panel.

    I have fitted laminate panels behind gas hobs on many occasions over the years, but never one as close as that. Personally, they haven't got a leg to stand on and need to come up with another option as just replacing the laminate panel will solve nothing.

    Snezza.
     
  9. metrokitchens

    metrokitchens Screwfix Select

    Unless the splash back is non combustible it should not be fitted behind a gas hob unless it is 15cm from the heat source.
    Typically this is possible using a 70cm deep top and measuring from the burner.
    Otherwise cover with a suitable clear glass panel - your best solution. I would have thought that your hob could be moved forward 5mm also. Every little helps :p
     
  10. Janet Weir

    Janet Weir New Member

    Thanks, Teabreak. I did make it very clear to the Sigma3 people that a gas hob was a must so as you said, the wrong materials were combined with it. I have emailed Neff (more or less what I said above) with photos clearly showing the damage and distances involved. I await their reply.
     
  11. Janet Weir

    Janet Weir New Member

    Thanks, Snezza. You have put the bottom line as we see it in a few words. I await an email from the projet manager to see if he has anyother options to offer!
     
  12. Janet Weir

    Janet Weir New Member

    Thanks again, Metrokitchens. We like the idea of a clear glass panel (or maybe even replacing the splashback with a new one in heat-proof coloured glass) and have already wondered if it would be possible to move the hob forward (if there is any leeway in the cut-out). A deeper top would mean the oven beneath the hob coming out 10 cm beyond the counter on either side, which seems too complicated as there are drawers on both sides and the oven is only 60 cm wide (narrower than the extra-wide hob). I should mention that we are talking about a fitter who made numerous mismeasurements large and small, starting with placing a socket inside the wall area where the splashback was planned and cutting one side of the L-shaped countertop 300 mm too short and the other 3 mm too short. I think the project manager is trying to avoid going down any route which would involve getting approval for the extra cost of replacing that section of L-shaped countertop yet again in order to reposition the cut-out. This is undoubtedly because we had so many problems with the installation and their reaction to the fitter's mistakes and delays that in the end we had no choice but to approach the company CEO directly. We thought we had finally resolved the problems when we had an apology and a modest gesture of good will but unfortunately the scorching appeared.
     
  13. linda123

    linda123 New Member

     
  14. Saajida bhana

    Saajida bhana New Member

    Hi
    I also have a similar problem.
    A new kitchen installed with quartz splashback.
    However the gas hob is very close to the quartz splash back,will it burn or discolour in time?
    I’m actually scared to use my gas hob now.
     

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